If Queens needs another trunkline...

[Deucey]

Where would you route it? Is it on one street (ie Metropolitan Av); is it on multiple streets? Is it east-west, crosstown? Where does it run in Manhattan?

 

Etc.

 

 

(Been looking at maps of the Second System and I can't make heads/tails of them.)

[LGA Link N Train]

Where would you route it? Is it on one street (ie Metropolitan Av); is it on multiple streets? Is it east-west, crosstown? Where does it run in Manhattan?

 

Etc.

 

 

(Been looking at maps of the Second System and I can't make heads/tails of them.)

......................... I'm pretty sure that Queens is only going to need a few branches rather than trunk lines (i. e. RBB, Queens bypass, LGA extension, laureton branch) , though if you were to build a trunk line, I would do that on the LIE. Queens sadly only has 1 trunk line and that's Queens Blvd (I take the and/or and despite it being congested most of the time, it does a pretty good job at being the only trunk)

 

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[Eric B]

If they built a whole new trunk, it would be the "bypass" (taking space on the LIRR mainline). 

Other plans tied 63rd St. with the Montauk line west of Jamaica.

[Kamen Rider]

Metro carrying a trunk line would be... I'm going to go with "interesting". 

 

As much as I would love to roll out of bed and roll down the block to a train station, it just doesn't feel like the kind of street that could handle a full blown trunk line. Even I more readily envision an Airtrain style elevated "Light Metro".  

 

I'm more in favor of augmenting the existing and currently closed LIRR tracks in the borough with a London Overground style "rapid rail" system.  

[CenSin]

......................... I'm pretty sure that Queens is only going to need a few branches rather than trunk lines (i. e. RBB, Queens bypass, LGA extension, laureton branch) , though if you were to build a trunk line, I would do that on the LIE. Queens sadly only has 1 trunk line and that's Queens Blvd (I take the and/or and despite it being congested most of the time, it does a pretty good job at being the only trunk)

Perception is relative.

 

If you got a bowl of rice for a day in North Korea, that’s pretty good.

[RR503]

Perception is relative.

 

If you got a bowl of rice for a day in North Korea, that’s pretty good.

We're not in North Korea.

 

Manhattan, Bx, Bk all have multiple trunks. It's time Queens got their rice too.

[quadcorder]

Bronx doesn't have trunks, it has branches (some of which have express service). Similarly, most of Brooklyn is served by branches. Trunks are necessary where many branches come together. Queens needs better coverage, e.g. more branches. Additional trunks beyond Bypass should not be necessary for that.

[N6 Limited]

Queens doesn't really need another trunk line. It could use some extensions though. Extend the from Middle Village the LIE then east to Fresh Meadows.  Extend the or to Laguardia and College Point, etc. 

 

Extend the Church Ave to 205th Street via the Bronx via QB/Main St/ Hutchinson Parkway/Bay Plaza/Pelham Parkway/Fordham Rd to replace the Q44 and BX12    If that Bronx routing is too much it can follow the Cross Bronx Expressway to connect with all the subway lines then use the existing tunnel(s) at 178th and 179th street to connect to the 175 St Station/yard on the .

[bobtehpanda]

The most obvious candidates for another trunk besides the bypass are either Astoria Blvd or Northern Blvd. The needs relief.

 

You could actually hit multiple high traffic corridors using the same line; 86th St -> Astoria Blvd -> Flushing -> Jamaica. But that's just getting too foamy.

[CenSin]

The most obvious candidates for another trunk besides the bypass are either Astoria Blvd or Northern Blvd. The needs relief.

 

You could actually hit multiple high traffic corridors using the same line; 86th St -> Astoria Blvd -> Flushing -> Jamaica. But that's just getting too foamy.

If that alignment terminated at 5 Avenue or something, I could see it working out. Over to the west side, the line would miss connections to the 7 Avenue expresses and the Central Park West expresses.

[BreeddekalbL]

The L.i.e trunk was originally proposed in 1968

[CenSin]

The L.i.e trunk was originally proposed in 1968

34 Street crosstown line?

[LGA Link N Train]

34 Street crosstown line?

That's a Manhattan line and would've been most likely a shuttle. I think that it should be connected to the Montauk branch and go out to Jamaica and probably beyond that. The current LIC and Hunters Point stations. .... idk what will happen to them

 

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[bobtehpanda]

If that alignment terminated at 5 Avenue or something, I could see it working out. Over to the west side, the line would miss connections to the 7 Avenue expresses and the Central Park West expresses.

 

Whenever I've thought about it, the stops in Manhattan usually look like this:

 

86th/3rd (Lex/2nd, for the

5th/Met (optional if it's too difficult to build, since half the catchment is Central Park)

86th/Columbus, transfer to the 8th Av Line

72nd/Amsterdam (or somewhat a little south) for 7th Avenue.

 

That way the tunnel is perfectly positioned for a future FWS line (since the FWS is also very congested on existing subway lines).

 

Really, if I were to do it, it would be LRT a-la the Boston Green Line, with branches fanning out to College Point and down Main/Kissena/164th, replacing the Q44, Q25, and Q65.

That's a Manhattan line and would've been most likely a shuttle. I think that it should be connected to the Montauk branch and go out to Jamaica and probably beyond that. The current LIC and Hunters Point stations. .... idk what will happen to them

 

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34th St is a really poor choice of crosstown, given the distance from most of Midtown's jobs and the difficulty of building so close to the LIRR tunnels. (Yes, HY exists, but building a subway line just for HY already happened.)

[CenSin]

34th St is a really poor choice of crosstown, given the distance from most of Midtown's jobs and the difficulty of building so close to the LIRR tunnels. (Yes, HY exists, but building a subway line just for HY already happened.)

A 34 Street crosstown line in the context of an LIE alignment in Queens would be different. Such a line would either connect to the Flushing Line () or the Crosstown Line (), or terminate at Hunters Point Avenue. I don’t see any of those options as logical for obvious reasons.

 

Following other streets on the grid, one could see that the tracks could “hop off” the LIE at some point and connect with two other lines:

• 53 Street Tunnel
  • 44 Drive
  • (cutting across the LIRR tracks perpendicularly)
  • 29 Street
  • 49 Avenue
  • Hunters Point Avenue
  • LIE
• Canarsie Line
  • Avenue C and 14 Street
  • (cutting across the East River diagonally)
  • Greenpoint Avenue
  • LIE

I don’t see any superior advantage to either of these two approaches either though.

[Deucey]

A 34 Street crosstown line in the context of an LIE alignment in Queens would be different. Such a line would either connect to the Flushing Line () or the Crosstown Line (), or terminate at Hunters Point Avenue. I don’t see any of those options as logical for obvious reasons.

 

Following other streets on the grid, one could see that the tracks could “hop off” the LIE at some point and connect with two other lines:

• 53 Street Tunnel
  • 44 Drive
  • (cutting across the LIRR tracks perpendicularly)
  • 29 Street
  • 49 Avenue
  • Hunters Point Avenue
  • LIE
• Canarsie Line
  • Avenue C and 14 Street
  • (cutting across the East River diagonally)
  • Greenpoint Avenue
  • LIE

I don’t see any superior advantage to either of these two approaches either though.

What about a 125th St Crosstown connecting to GCP/BQE then LIE, With a branch to LGA?

[RR503]

What about a 125th St Crosstown connecting to GCP/BQE then LIE, With a branch to LGA?

No one wants to go to midtown via 125th st from Queens

 

I vote for a line from Queens on Northern Boulevard (or the LIE, or splits and does both) that runs under 86th st, connecting to SAS, Lex Lines, tunnels under Central Park, connects with CPW, and then heads south under Amsterdam/10th ave to 8th avenue on the L.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

No one wants to go to midtown via 125th st from Queens

 

I vote for a line from Queens on Northern Boulevard (or the LIE, or splits and does both) that runs under 86th st, connecting to SAS, Lex Lines, tunnels under Central Park, connects with CPW, and then heads south under Amsterdam/10th ave to 8th avenue on the L.

I for one have always wondered why there aren't more crosstown shuttles anyway? Why just the one at 42nd street that goes what 3 - 4 city blocks?   I should remind you that a few lines run east-west and people don't even blink an eye so if there weren't that many stops, I don't think people would care.  Just look at how crowded the M60 is.

[RR503]

I for one have always wondered why there aren't more crosstown shuttles anyway? Why just the one at 42nd street that goes what 3 - 4 city blocks? I should remind you that a few lines run east-west and people don't even blink an eye so if there weren't that many stops, I don't think people would care. Just look at how crowded the M60 is.

It's not the actual crosstown portion that's the issue -- it's the massively roundabout route that trains would have to take to get there. What will end up happening is folks will dump this service asap for more direct trains into Manhattan, worsening existing crowding.

 

I do agree that we need more crosstown service -- don't you think 125 is much better served with an extended SAS though?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

It's not the actual crosstown portion that's the issue -- it's the massively roundabout route that trains would have to take to get there. What will end up happening is folks will dump this service asap for more direct trains into Manhattan, worsening existing crowding.

 

I do agree that we need more crosstown service -- don't you think 125 is much better served with an extended SAS though?

Well I brought up the Times Square shuttle for a reason.  Sure it's great not to have to walk from Grand Central to Times Square, but at the same time, the waiting for the train to pull out the terminal after certain hours can make it not that advantageous, so I'm more in favor of trains running more than just a few blocks.  I would have to see the routes on a map before commenting further as to whether a route from Queens or an SAS extension would make more sense.  

[N6 Limited]

I for one have always wondered why there aren't more crosstown shuttles anyway? Why just the one at 42nd street that goes what 3 - 4 city blocks?   I should remind you that a few lines run east-west and people don't even blink an eye so if there weren't that many stops, I don't think people would care.  Just look at how crowded the M60 is.

The one on 42nd st just happens to be left over scraps of the original subway line.  The original line was the Lex(Park Ave) line from Brooklyn Bridge to Grand Central,the 42nd Shuttle, and the 7th Ave(Broadway) line from Times Square to Van C. Park.  When they Extended both (Down 7th Ave and up Lexington Ave) to make the Eastside and Westside lines, the Shuttle became the connector between them which they called the "H system."  If not for that there would be No crosstown shuttles in Manhattan, just the , and as there is now.

 

It's not the actual crosstown portion that's the issue -- it's the massively roundabout route that trains would have to take to get there. What will end up happening is folks will dump this service asap for more direct trains into Manhattan, worsening existing crowding.

 

I do agree that we need more crosstown service -- don't you think 125 is much better served with an extended SAS though?

I do. If there are any issues with one of the existing lines. people can take the crosstown across down 2nd Ave to bypass the mess.

 

Well I brought up the Times Square shuttle for a reason.  Sure it's great not to have to walk from Grand Central to Times Square, but at the same time, the waiting for the train to pull out the terminal after certain hours can make it not that advantageous, so I'm more in favor of trains running more than just a few blocks.  I would have to see the routes on a map before commenting further as to whether a route from Queens or an SAS extension would make more sense.  

They could loop the up 10th/Ansterdam  Aves to become an 86th street Crosstown and build a better terminal on the East side.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The one on 42nd st just happens to be left over scraps of the original subway line.  The original line was the Lex(Park Ave) line from Brooklyn Bridge to Grand Central,the 42nd Shuttle, and the 7th Ave(Broadway) line from Times Square to Van C. Park.  When they Extended both (Down 7th Ave and up Lexington Ave) to make the Eastside and Westside lines, the Shuttle became the connector between them which they called the "H system."  If not for that there would be No crosstown shuttles in Manhattan, just the , and as there is now.

 

I do. If there are any issues with one of the existing lines. people can take the crosstown across down 2nd Ave to bypass the mess.

 

They could loop the up to become an 86th street Crosstown and build a better terminal on the East side.

I think the current is stupid.  Run the damn thing over to 12th Avenue and across to 1st. Would alleviate so much congestion along 42nd.  There are times when I'm along 42nd and need to be past 8th Avenue and I so dread taking that slow M42, but walking in the hot weather is just as bad.

 

How exactly would the work?

[LGA Link N Train]

What I would do is put a crosstown line on 46 Street staring at 12 Av and it will replace LIRR Hunts Point station and the Montauk branch

 

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[CenSin]

What about a 125th St Crosstown connecting to GCP/BQE then LIE, With a branch to LGA?

That takes people away from the central business district. It’s like an Uber driver deliberately taking the long way to make more money and to waste your time.

[Deucey]

That takes people away from the central business district. It’s like an Uber driver deliberately taking the long way to make more money and to waste your time.

I'm thinking along the lines of crosstown traffic. Waiting for a bus to go down 125th is interminable, but if done right, it could be a branch of a new Queens mainline or supplement - Harlem to Astoria to LGA to wherever else (ie replace the M60 and maybe the Q70/Cuomo's stupid train).

 

Have another branch crosstown along 86th or 72nd St to meet that same mainline or supplement as well.

 

Doesn't even need to be heavy rail - LRT like MBTA's Green Line could be sufficient.