qjtransitmaster Posted July 29, 2014 Share #3526 Posted July 29, 2014 That would make the 34 too long... Not if Q34 as suggested by I don't know but another member suggested termination of the Q34 at flushing not going south of there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted July 31, 2014 Share #3527 Posted July 31, 2014 This is a very simple solution to something that's been bugging me for quite some time. I propose to start the QM5 via Fresh Meadows variation (towards Midtown) earlier. This will come without cutting any QM1 trips at all (However, I've always been bothered with the QM1 running until 4:40 PM to Midtown. I was always, am, and probably forever be annoyed by that, especially when the QM5 comes at around the same times). The last QM1 from Fresh Meadows leaves at 4:40 PM. The following bus (which is the first QM5 to Manhattan via Fresh Meadows) arrives at 188 Street/ 64 Avenue at 6:19 PM. As noticed, there is a 99 minute gap between that time period. My proposal is to begin the variation to Fresh Meadows starting with the 5:10 PM to Midtown, arriving at about 5:32-ish to 188 Street/ 64 Avenue. Therefore, the spacing would be around 45-50 minutes during that time period instead of 99. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aemoreira81 Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3528 Posted August 2, 2014 Not if Q34 as suggested by I don't know but another member suggested termination of the Q34 at flushing not going south of there. Under such a scenario, the Q25 would have short turns that terminate at the College Point Depot (by the theater and Toys'R'Us). I think that it may be time to give the Q34 its own unique market, and provide local service along Willets Point Boulevard. This route would be pretty straightforward: Flushing to Fort Totten via Mitchell Gardens and Willets Point Boulevard. The Q16 would also be simplified as it would have only one branch with better headways. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewFlyer 230 Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3529 Posted August 2, 2014 Under such a scenario, the Q25 would have short turns that terminate at the College Point Depot (by the theater and Toys'R'Us). I think that it may be time to give the Q34 its own unique market, and provide local service along Willets Point Boulevard. This route would be pretty straightforward: Flushing to Fort Totten via Mitchell Gardens and Willets Point Boulevard. The Q16 would also be simplified as it would have only one branch with better headways. The problem is that the Q16 generates as much usage as it gets now because of the two branches. The Francis Lewis and Willets Point branch being used much more than Utopia Parkway. Utopia isnt dead but it sees the most usage during rush hours. The MTA knows that the Q34 will only hurt the Q16 in the long run when people see that it run more frequent than the Q16 and serves Flushing directly. That's why I believe the Q34 is staying where it is for now the most being extended to Francis Lewis to connect to the Q16 and Q76. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3530 Posted August 2, 2014 This is a very simple solution to something that's been bugging me for quite some time. I propose to start the QM5 via Fresh Meadows variation (towards Midtown) earlier. This will come without cutting any QM1 trips at all (However, I've always been bothered with the QM1 running until 4:40 PM to Midtown. I was always, am, and probably forever be annoyed by that, especially when the QM5 comes at around the same times). The last QM1 from Fresh Meadows leaves at 4:40 PM. The following bus (which is the first QM5 to Manhattan via Fresh Meadows) arrives at 188 Street/ 64 Avenue at 6:19 PM. As noticed, there is a 99 minute gap between that time period. My proposal is to begin the variation to Fresh Meadows starting with the 5:10 PM to Midtown, arriving at about 5:32-ish to 188 Street/ 64 Avenue. Therefore, the spacing would be around 45-50 minutes during that time period instead of 99. Well you might as well get over it... Ridership on the QM1 is growing so I don't see any cuts coming. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3531 Posted August 2, 2014 Well you might as well get over it... Ridership on the QM1 is growing so I don't see any cuts coming. Yeah, but if you looked at it, overall ridership on weekdays on the Union Tpke Routes Went down. The QM1 and 6 did go up, but the 5 went down more than the 1 and 6 went up combined. And I don't know if it's just coincidence or something, but the QM1 ridership on weekdays went up by the same number of riders the QM4 went down. Weekend Ridership went up though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3532 Posted August 2, 2014 (edited) Yeah, but if you looked at it, overall ridership on weekdays on the Union Tpke Routes Went down. The QM1 and 6 did go up, but the 5 went down more than the 1 and 6 went up combined. And I don't know if it's just coincidence or something, but the QM1 ridership on weekdays went up by the same number of riders the QM4 went down. Weekend Ridership went up though. It's called fluctuations. People have options so they're naturally going to shift from the QM1 to the QM5 to the QM6. It doesn't take much but a B/O who comes late regularly for ridership to go up and down. Just like here people flip flop between the BxM1, BxM2 and BxM18, and if I know that the BxM2 driver is slow or comes late a lot, well I'm going to stop taking him and stick with the BxM1 if possible, until a new pick starts and then I may shift again to some other bus. I've been taking the BxM1 a lot because there's a driver that hauls @ss that I would get on the BxM2. I do the same thing when I'm Queens. I may take the QM6 to Queens, and the QM5 back to the city. Edited August 2, 2014 by Via Garibaldi 8 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3533 Posted August 2, 2014 It's called fluctuations. People have options so they're naturally going to shift from the QM1 to the QM5 to the QM6. It doesn't take much but a B/O who comes late regularly for ridership to go up and down. Just like here people flip flop between the BxM1, BxM2 and BxM18, and if I know that the BxM2 driver is slow or comes late a lot, well I'm going to stop taking him and stick with the BxM1 if possible, until a new pick starts and then I may shift again to some other bus. I've been taking the BxM1 a lot because there's a driver that hauls @ss that I would get on the BxM2. I do the same thing when I'm Queens. I may take the QM6 to Queens, and the QM5 back to the city. That's not the point. Yeah, you have options (I'm on the north end of the QM1, so I have option for the 1, or the 5 down two blocks, or if I feel like it, the 6 on the Turnpike). What I'm saying is, ridership on the 5 went down by 75 riders. The QM6 had an increase of 5 riders. Yeah, those 5 riders may have been QM5 riders. However, the QM1 had an increase of 47 riders. 47+5 does not equal close to 75. And if you look at the QM4, ridership went down by 47 riders. The point I was trying to make is, anyone of the three routes sees a consistent decline in ridership, and you know the 1 will eventually pay the price for it (moreso if it's the QM5 which declines, which is what's happening in this case). I've been on QM1's with suitable ridership, I've been one 1's with not so good ridership, but you understand what I'm saying here? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3534 Posted August 2, 2014 That's not the point. Yeah, you have options (I'm on the north end of the QM1, so I have option for the 1, or the 5 down two blocks, or if I feel like it, the 6 on the Turnpike). What I'm saying is, ridership on the 5 went down by 75 riders. The QM6 had an increase of 5 riders. Yeah, those 5 riders may have been QM5 riders. However, the QM1 had an increase of 47 riders. 47+5 does not equal close to 75. And if you look at the QM4, ridership went down by 47 riders. The point I was trying to make is, anyone of the three routes sees a consistent decline in ridership, and you know the 1 will eventually pay the price for it (moreso if it's the QM5 which declines, which is what's happening in this case). I've been on QM1's with suitable ridership, I've been one 1's with not so good ridership, but you understand what I'm saying here? Let me repeat myself... Ridership fluctuates... It will increase, decrease, etc., for a number of reasons. 47 or even 75 riders is not the end of the world, when some routes lose and gain thousands of riders each year. I do have a question about the QM5 though. How does it serve Fresh Meadows at 188th and 64th & continue along 73rd to Glen Oaks during late nights? Does it loop or something? I saw the area by 188th & 64th and it appears that the bus could make those stops and then come back around. Those stops must be pretty big if it does that. Must be some co-ops or condos over there... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3535 Posted August 2, 2014 (edited) Let me repeat myself... Ridership fluctuates... It will increase, decrease, etc., for a number of reasons. 47 or even 75 riders is not the end of the world, when some routes lose and gain thousands of riders each year. I do have a question about the QM5 though. How does it serve Fresh Meadows at 188th and 64th & continue along 73rd to Glen Oaks during late nights? Does it loop or something? I saw the area by 188th & 64th and it appears that the bus could make those stops and then come back around. Those stops must be pretty big if it does that. Must be some co-ops or condos over there... Okay, now it sounds more reasonable, because the way you said it the first time, made it sound like people were just switching between the three. And yes, the QM5 lost more than 7000 riders last year. The 47 and 75 were only weekday counts. And yes, the 5 loops around the apartment buildings, up 188 st, around the circle at 64 Avenue, then down 188 street. Those stops are rather light after like 2 PM, the 5 goes there because the 1 doesn't run. (I hate writing on my phone with such a passion). Edited August 2, 2014 by BM5 via Woodhaven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted August 2, 2014 Share #3536 Posted August 2, 2014 And yes, the 5 loops around the apartment buildings, up 188 st, around the circle at 64 Avenue, then down 188 street. Those stops are rather light after like 2 PM, the 5 goes there because the 1 doesn't run. (I hate writing on my phone with such a passion). Yeah I know why... Just wanted to understand the stop procedure with the QM5... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3537 Posted August 3, 2014 This is a very simple solution to something that's been bugging me for quite some time. I propose to start the QM5 via Fresh Meadows variation (towards Midtown) earlier. This will come without cutting any QM1 trips at all (However, I've always been bothered with the QM1 running until 4:40 PM to Midtown. I was always, am, and probably forever be annoyed by that, especially when the QM5 comes at around the same times). The last QM1 from Fresh Meadows leaves at 4:40 PM. The following bus (which is the first QM5 to Manhattan via Fresh Meadows) arrives at 188 Street/ 64 Avenue at 6:19 PM. As noticed, there is a 99 minute gap between that time period. My proposal is to begin the variation to Fresh Meadows starting with the 5:10 PM to Midtown, arriving at about 5:32-ish to 188 Street/ 64 Avenue. Therefore, the spacing would be around 45-50 minutes during that time period instead of 99. Ok, but the question is..... What outbound trip is that 5:10 towards midtown, once it gets to manhattan around 6:30? * If that's a bus that DH's back to the depot after that 5:10 inbound trip (which I doubt), then I'd say why not to your change.... * However, if that bus does an outbound trip afterwards (hell, we don't even know if that same bus [is/will be] even a QM5, or if it does a QM1 or a QM6 trip) is indeed an outbound trip, then you'd end up screwing up the outbound headways with that extension of that 5:10 trip towards midtown, for w/e route (QM1/5/6) that same bus ends up becoming for it's corresponding outbound trip...... ---- Your real gripe is the fact that the QM1 has a short a span that it does.... The 99 minutes thing, I'm not putting stock in - You wouldn't care about whatever the difference in minutes was, if the QM1 ran later..... While I'm not gonna callously say get over it, I am gonna say that you can't just look at matters short-sightedly like that..... It's not as easy as just extending that 5:10pm trip via Fresh Meadows to account for the deficiency (you feel there is with) QM1 reverse peak PM service..... I'm gonna put this as plainly as I can - PM reverse peak (i.e, inbound) express trips are more often than not, used as decoys to setup PM outbound (peak) express trips..... Saying this another way, PM reverse peak trips don't primarily run for the sake of whoever may need the service, but to setup for the return PM peak trips to carry the masses back to their places of residence...... As f***ed up as that sounds, that's how it is..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3538 Posted August 3, 2014 (edited) Ok, but the question is..... What outbound trip is that 5:10 towards midtown, once it gets to manhattan around 6:30? * If that's a bus that DH's back to the depot after that 5:10 inbound trip (which I doubt), then I'd say why not to your change.... * However, if that bus does an outbound trip afterwards (hell, we don't even know if that same bus [is/will be] even a QM5, or if it does a QM1 or a QM6 trip) is indeed an outbound trip, then you'd end up screwing up the outbound headways with that extension of that 5:10 trip towards midtown, for w/e route (QM1/5/6) that same bus ends up becoming for it's corresponding outbound trip...... ---- Your real gripe is the fact that the QM1 has a short a span that it does.... The 99 minutes thing, I'm not putting stock in - You wouldn't care about whatever the difference in minutes was, if the QM1 ran later..... While I'm not gonna callously say get over it, I am gonna say that you can't just look at matters short-sightedly like that..... It's not as easy as just extending that 5:10pm trip via Fresh Meadows to account for the deficiency (you feel there is with) QM1 reverse peak PM service..... I'm gonna put this as plainly as I can - PM reverse peak (i.e, inbound) express trips are more often than not, used as decoys to setup PM outbound (peak) express trips..... Saying this another way, PM reverse peak trips don't primarily run for the sake of whoever may need the service, but to setup for the return PM peak trips to carry the masses back to their places of residence...... As f***ed up as that sounds, that's how it is..... Appearently, it does the last (and last Union Tpke outbound) 3 Avenue trip, before going DH'ing again to the depot. I think there is for some sort of flexibility here, if it actually does the last 3 Avenue trip. Edited August 3, 2014 by BM5 via Woodhaven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3539 Posted August 3, 2014 Appearently, it does the last (and last Union Tpke outbound) 3 Avenue trip, before going DH'ing again to the depot. I think there is for some sort of flexibility here, if it actually does the last 3 Avenue trip. How do you come to that conclusion? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3540 Posted August 3, 2014 How do you come to that conclusion? I can now confirm it (I looked at the run sheets). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3541 Posted August 3, 2014 I can now confirm it (I looked at the run sheets). Alright.... so now that that's confirmed.... What would end up happening with your suggestion, is the later running of that last 3rd av trip in question (leaving somewhere around 7:10-7:15, instead of 7:00)..... While I don't know the ridership of that particular trip, this suggestion of yours IMO is at best, a zero sum game either way - I'm not seeing how many people it's supposed to benefit on either accord (the Fresh Meadows folks seeking inbound express service around that time (that 5:32 or w/e) or whatever current riders that are taking that 7:00 3rd av QM5 back towards Queens)...... And for whatever few Fresh Meadows riders that would utilize buses running to Fresh Meadows around that time, you'd still inconvenience whatever current riders that are taking that last 3rd av QM5 trip...... I cannot believe that you would get much of anyone else seeking that last trip in question, have it depart/arrive 10-15 (estimate) mins. later... So to "sum" it up, this whole thing is moot AFAIC..... I'm not saying the idea is the worst thing in the world... I'm saying I don't see much of a point to having that particular trip (the 5:10) extended up to Fresh Meadows.... Making a point about a 99 minute gap means nothing if almost no one is affected by it..... Otherwise, it would have Been addressed..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3542 Posted August 3, 2014 (edited) Alright.... so now that that's confirmed.... What would end up happening with your suggestion, is the later running of that last 3rd av trip in question (leaving somewhere around 7:10-7:15, instead of 7:00)..... While I don't know the ridership of that particular trip, this suggestion of yours IMO is at best, a zero sum game either way - I'm not seeing how many people it's supposed to benefit on either accord (the Fresh Meadows folks seeking inbound express service around that time (that 5:32 or w/e) or whatever current riders that are taking that 7:00 3rd av QM5 back towards Queens)...... And for whatever few Fresh Meadows riders that would utilize buses running to Fresh Meadows around that time, you'd still inconvenience whatever current riders that are taking that last 3rd av QM5 trip...... I cannot believe that you would get much of anyone else seeking that last trip in question, have it depart/arrive 10-15 (estimate) mins. later... So to "sum" it up, this whole thing is moot AFAIC..... I'm not saying the idea is the worst thing in the world... I'm saying I don't see much of a point to having that particular trip (the 5:10) extended up to Fresh Meadows.... Making a point about a 99 minute gap means nothing if almost no one is affected by it..... Otherwise, it would have Been addressed..... I haven't been on that side of Manhattan in a while (probably since Spring), but that last QM5 does pretty well. I'd say the strongest stop is at 44 Street (Because when I would wait for the QM24 on the opposite side of the block, I would always see a line of 10-15 people there). I would've probably have made it for a 7:05 PM departure from 39 Street (since the headway between that, and the one before it is 20 minutes, and I wouldn't have wanted to over exceed 30). Edited August 3, 2014 by BM5 via Woodhaven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3543 Posted August 3, 2014 This is a very simple solution to something that's been bugging me for quite some time. I propose to start the QM5 via Fresh Meadows variation (towards Midtown) earlier. This will come without cutting any QM1 trips at all (However, I've always been bothered with the QM1 running until 4:40 PM to Midtown. I was always, am, and probably forever be annoyed by that, especially when the QM5 comes at around the same times). The last QM1 from Fresh Meadows leaves at 4:40 PM. The following bus (which is the first QM5 to Manhattan via Fresh Meadows) arrives at 188 Street/ 64 Avenue at 6:19 PM. As noticed, there is a 99 minute gap between that time period. My proposal is to begin the variation to Fresh Meadows starting with the 5:10 PM to Midtown, arriving at about 5:32-ish to 188 Street/ 64 Avenue. Therefore, the spacing would be around 45-50 minutes during that time period instead of 99. (I'm on the north end of the QM1, so I have option for the 1, or the 5 down two blocks, or if I feel like it, the 6 on the Turnpike). umm..... From another forum: QM1/QM4/QM5/QM6 Proposal: QM1: Bus runs in the AM rush hour only between 6:10 AM and 9:10 AM to Manhattan. After 7:55 AM, departs at 8:10 AM and 9:10 AM from Fresh Meadows. Bus Runs in the PM rush hour only between 4:30 PM and 7:00 PM to Fresh Meadows Total Savings: $609,600 QM4: Service extended during late AM rush and Middays to/from Fresh Meadows. First bus leaves Fresh Meadows to Manhattan at 8:52 AM, then at 9:52 AM, and every hour until 4:52 PM. First bus from Manhattan leaves to Fresh Meadows at 9:50, then every hour until 3:50 PM. Total Cost: $72,390 During this stop, an extra stop will be placed at Utopia Pkwy (by the Q17/Q88), and on 64 Avenue (to Fresh Meadows) QM5: Bus Schedule Changes From Manhattan: From 8:45 AM to 2:45 PM, buses run hourly to Glen Oaks Total Savings: $285,750 QM6: The 8:05 to 2:05 trips will depart 6/36 on :15 instead at :05. One QM6 trip to Queens added at 3:35 PM running until Glen Oaks (Union Tpke/260 Street) Total Cost: $41,275 895,350 <---- Total savings 113,665 <---- Total cost ------------------------------ 781,685 <---- Net savings So you want to... - ....turn the QM1 into a peak direction only route.... ([keeping 13 inbound AM trips & cutting 11 inbound trips] & [keeping 11 outbound PM trips & cutting 9 outbound trips] - ....extend 9 current trips (from 9am-5pm) on the QM4 to Fresh Meadows, extend 3 current trips (from 9:50am-11:50am) on the QM4 to Fresh Meadows, and add 4 trips on the QM4 to Fresh Meadows..... - ....cut 6 (out of the 13) morning-midday outbound trips on the QM5 (in other words, buses run hourly instead of half hourly) - ...add an outbound trip on the QM6 @ 3:35. I knew something didn't pass the smell test with your whole QM1/5/6 mentions; prior & current plans..... You're morphing service so you won't have to put up w/ the any of the Union Tpke. expresses & instead, subject yourself to the more consistent (and stably utilized) QM4.... I don't understand how (or why) you're worrying about cuts to the QM1 when you're proposing them yourself... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3544 Posted August 3, 2014 umm..... 895,350 <---- Total savings 113,665 <---- Total cost ------------------------------ 781,685 <---- Net savings So you want to... - ....turn the QM1 into a peak direction only route.... ([keeping 13 inbound AM trips & cutting 11 inbound trips] & [keeping 11 outbound PM trips & cutting 9 outbound trips] - ....extend 9 current trips (from 9am-5pm) on the QM4 to Fresh Meadows, extend 3 current trips (from 9:50am-11:50am) on the QM4 to Fresh Meadows, and add 4 trips on the QM4 to Fresh Meadows..... - ....cut 6 (out of the 13) morning-midday outbound trips on the QM5 (in other words, buses run hourly instead of half hourly) - ...add an outbound trip on the QM6 @ 3:35. I knew something didn't pass the smell test with your whole QM1/5/6 mentions; prior & current plans..... You're morphing service so you won't have to put up w/ the any of the Union Tpke. expresses & instead, subject yourself to the more consistent (and stably utilized) QM4.... I don't understand how (or why) you're worrying about cuts to the QM1 when you're proposing them yourself... That proposal was from yesterday, compared from the one three days ago. Actual, 9 outbound trips would get discontinued in that proposal. The proposal doesn't touch 3rd Avenue service at all, and 8 inbound. The rest is correct, however. The reason I proposed this was for four reasons: 1. I think that the QM1 in other words, "blocks" the QM5 and QM6 during the off peak period in an effort of gaining ridership (moreso the 5). I think Union Tpke can handle the QM5/QM6 during those periods, even though those routes will be heavier in terms of ridership per trip. This way, the 5/6 can be better scheduled along Union Tpke, without having the 1 interfere through. This leads to my second reason 2. There could be better scheduling/ amount of buses on the Turnpike. Now, I don't really cut this and that without a reason, sois there really a necessity for 15 minute headways from like 8:45 AM up to like 2:45 PM combined? I think Union Tpke can handle 30 minute headways, but 15 is just pushing it. I honestly don't think there's a need for it. I'm not saying there isn't ridership for any of the portions past 188, but I find it insane that the 6 is the one that has the most riders per trip during the segment before 12 PM, and the QM1/5's have about the same amount of ridership, spread out over three trips. 3. Have additional ridership flow onto the QM4. The QM4 doesn't do that bad (Some of the trips to Manhattan after like 10 AM are mediocre though, and the QM1 still has a good flow of ridership from the first stop as far out as 12 PM or 1 PM, heading to Manhattan). Interrelated to this : 4. Encourage more ridership from Fresh Meadows. The stop at Utopia won't pick up much, but it's still some ridership that could be gain from here, especially since that area has no near express bus unless they walk down to 188 or 164. When I say Fresh Meadows, I'm not just talking about the area by 188/64, I'm talking about the areas west of it, still within Fresh Meadows. Trip times will still be the same for the most part. I tried to make it cost-efficient as possible. I'm not worried about the QM1 getting cut, I'm worried about the other routes around it. The QM1 had an increase of 15000 riders last year, and the QM4 and QM5 went down 8000 and 7000 (IIRC; respectively). The QM6 did gain ridership, like in the high 6000's so that's a good thing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted August 3, 2014 Share #3545 Posted August 3, 2014 (edited) That proposal was from yesterday, compared from the one three days ago. Actual, 9 outbound trips would get discontinued in that proposal. The proposal doesn't touch 3rd Avenue service at all, and 8 inbound. The rest is correct, however. The reason I proposed this was for four reasons: 1. I think that the QM1 in other words, "blocks" the QM5 and QM6 during the off peak period in an effort of gaining ridership (moreso the 5). I think Union Tpke can handle the QM5/QM6 during those periods, even though those routes will be heavier in terms of ridership per trip. This way, the 5/6 can be better scheduled along Union Tpke, without having the 1 interfere through. This leads to my second reason 2. There could be better scheduling/ amount of buses on the Turnpike. Now, I don't really cut this and that without a reason, so is there really a necessity for 15 minute headways from like 8:45 AM up to like 2:45 PM combined? I think Union Tpke can handle 30 minute headways, but 15 is just pushing it. I honestly don't think there's a need for it. I'm not saying there isn't ridership for any of the portions past 188, but I find it insane that the 6 is the one that has the most riders per trip during the segment before 12 PM, and the QM1/5's have about the same amount of ridership, spread out over three trips. 3. Have additional ridership flow onto the QM4. The QM4 doesn't do that bad (Some of the trips to Manhattan after like 10 AM are mediocre though, and the QM1 still has a good flow of ridership from the first stop as far out as 12 PM or 1 PM, heading to Manhattan). Interrelated to this : 4. Encourage more ridership from Fresh Meadows. The stop at Utopia won't pick up much, but it's still some ridership that could be gain from here, especially since that area has no near express bus unless they walk down to 188 or 164. When I say Fresh Meadows, I'm not just talking about the area by 188/64, I'm talking about the areas west of it, still within Fresh Meadows. Trip times will still be the same for the most part. I tried to make it cost-efficient as possible. I'm not worried about the QM1 getting cut, I'm worried about the other routes around it. The QM1 had an increase of 15000 riders last year, and the QM4 and QM5 went down 8000 and 7000 (IIRC; respectively). The QM6 did gain ridership, like in the high 6000's so that's a good thing. 1) ....Which makes it worse. 2) Alright, but you never made that distinction..... 3) * reason 1 - So the solution is to turn the QM1 into a peak direction only route & extend the QM4 to Fresh Meadows? You're making it sound like the majority of people are taking QM1's & are hardly taking (moreso) the QM5's.... I'm sorry, but the QM4 has nothing to do with what you're trying to address - which is really Union Tpke. service.... If I were a QM4 rider, I would be irate @ what you're proposing here.... * reason 3 sounds like a convenient excuse.... That can be said for any extension. (I know the QM4 doesn't do that bad.... which is why you think it should run to fresh meadows, instead of the QM1 that (in your opinion) insufficiently serves fresh meadows during off peak hrs....) * reasons 2 & 4 illustrate what I think this is all about... This isn't about you not cutting anything without a reason at all - Matter fact, on the contrary.... Seems to me that you think there is too much service given to Union Tpke (east of fresh meadows) & too little given to Fresh Meadows during the off peak hrs (when I say fresh meadows, I'm talking about the neighborhood, not just one corridor/roadway that exists along it).... I don't believe that is the case at all.... I don't believe there is untapped usage during off peak hours in that neighborhood (which is what's being implicated).... What's also a bit troubling, is the amount of cuts there are (in yesterday's proposal) - Savings is good, but surely you're not in it to simply save the MTA 3/4 of a million (approx.) for no reason, so what gives.... I think your proposal there was very calculating, so you're looking to save x amount of dollars for a reason.... Also, You're not worried about cuts to the QM1? Explain this part of your statement: "The point I was trying to make is, anyone of the three routes sees a consistent decline in ridership, and you know the 1 will eventually pay the price for it (moreso if it's the QM5 which declines, which is what's happening in this case)" If you're not saying, if there is a consistent declination in ridership on the QM5 and/or QM6, the QM1 would see cuts.... Then what exactly are you saying with this? What do you mean by "pay the price" then.... Rhetorically speaking, how much ridership is there really during the off peak hours on the QM1.... Edited August 3, 2014 by B35 via Church 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted August 4, 2014 Share #3546 Posted August 4, 2014 1) ....Which makes it worse. 2) Alright, but you never made that distinction..... 3) * reason 1 - So the solution is to turn the QM1 into a peak direction only route & extend the QM4 to Fresh Meadows? You're making it sound like the majority of people are taking QM1's & are hardly taking (moreso) the QM5's.... I'm sorry, but the QM4 has nothing to do with what you're trying to address - which is really Union Tpke. service.... If I were a QM4 rider, I would be irate @ what you're proposing here.... * reason 3 sounds like a convenient excuse.... That can be said for any extension. (I know the QM4 doesn't do that bad.... which is why you think it should run to fresh meadows, instead of the QM1 that (in your opinion) insufficiently serves fresh meadows during off peak hrs....) * reasons 2 & 4 illustrate what I think this is all about... This isn't about you not cutting anything without a reason at all - Matter fact, on the contrary.... Seems to me that you think there is too much service given to Union Tpke (east of fresh meadows) & too little given to Fresh Meadows during the off peak hrs (when I say fresh meadows, I'm talking about the neighborhood, not just one corridor/roadway that exists along it).... I don't believe that is the case at all.... I don't believe there is untapped usage during off peak hours in that neighborhood (which is what's being implicated).... What's also a bit troubling, is the amount of cuts there are (in yesterday's proposal) - Savings is good, but surely you're not in it to simply save the MTA 3/4 of a million (approx.) for no reason, so what gives.... I think your proposal there was very calculating, so you're looking to save x amount of dollars for a reason.... Also, You're not worried about cuts to the QM1? Explain this part of your statement: If you're not saying, if there is a consistent declination in ridership on the QM5 and/or QM6, the QM1 would see cuts.... Then what exactly are you saying with this? What do you mean by "pay the price" then.... Rhetorically speaking, how much ridership is there really during the off peak hours on the QM1.... 2) My mistake then. 3) No, people mix between the two (1/5) often, but I think the QM5 can handle the two loads of ridership from 73 Avenue and down, which is what I'm implicating. The times would be the same on the QM4 going to and from Manhattan. Times wouldn't change at all, and the ride is slightly faster to Fresh Meadows. Basically, It's grouping the QM1 riders in each trip on different buses based on destinations. The QM4 would run hourly though, and the same level of service would remain to the two QM1 stops north of 73 Avenue, so I'm not running extra service nor adding service in Fresh Meadows (however, there's a new section within Fresh Meadows served, which I'll give you that). The QM4 basically replaces the QM1 in that section, and the extra stop is there to catch any additional riders (It won't be loaded, but there could be a possibly of getting at least some ridership from there). The savings were only for those in revenue, if the DH trips were included in this count (which I didn't; there would be a few ; the current 9:15 AM, 10:15 AM, and 11:15 AM QM5 trips that would DH to Glen Oaks to start to the 10:40, 11:10, and 12:40 trips, respectively), the net savings would be less than that. As for the second quote, I see where you're coming from that I'd be worried if the QM1 gets cut (since the two northern stops on the 1 would be unserved, but if that happened, I would (hope so) the MTA provides service there with the 5 during middays. So If the 1 got cut, I would think the 5 would replace it (which is good, because it gets two busloads onto busload, which is perfectly fine; they can all get a seat). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted August 4, 2014 Share #3547 Posted August 4, 2014 Okay, now it sounds more reasonable, because the way you said it the first time, made it sound like people were just switching between the three. And yes, the QM5 lost more than 7000 riders last year. The 47 and 75 were only weekday counts. And yes, the 5 loops around the apartment buildings, up 188 st, around the circle at 64 Avenue, then down 188 street. Those stops are rather light after like 2 PM, the 5 goes there because the 1 doesn't run. (I hate writing on my phone with such a passion). hmm qm5? Speak to riders and find out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armandito Posted August 6, 2014 Share #3548 Posted August 6, 2014 Q114: Local service between Parsons Blvd/89 Av in Jamaica and 150 Av/130 St in South Ozone Park, via Guy R Brewer Blvd, Foch Blvd, and 130 St. Bus will operate 24/7. Here's the link: https://mapsengine.g...tw.klUjVM468Yjg 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted August 6, 2014 Author Share #3549 Posted August 6, 2014 Yeah, I don't think that will work... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armandito Posted August 6, 2014 Share #3550 Posted August 6, 2014 (edited) Sorry, it appears the URL on the last post doesn't work. So here's the link again: https://mapsengine.google.com/map/edit?mid=zh758mgJc1tw.klUjVM468Yjg Edited August 6, 2014 by lara8710 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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