Queens Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

[Q67 via Borden]

Yes, of course the 20a gets the usage over the 20b b/c it serves the mall.... That's the point.

 

A short walk from north side of the mall? The entrances to the stores are all on the south end of the mall (20th av)...

 

As far as the conversion/idea is concerned.... I get what you're saying - I simply don't agree with the logic.... It is not as easy as having current Q20a riders shift onto Q20b's & expect those same Q20a riders to walk from 14th av. to get to the mall.... I can guarantee you'd lose ridership on that Q20 relabeled route or w/e..... I mean, if that's the end goal here with believing such a move should happen, then I would say mission accomplished (this goes out to BreedDekalb as well)....

 

 

Comprehension man... comprehension....

 

Never said or implicated those 3 routes were redundant.... At all.

It was an example I used to illustrate how the Q76 & the Q20a are not redundant...

 

The point I was making in that example was, the B25/26/52 are not redundant b/c they share a portion of their route & have a common terminal - Just like the Q76 is not redundant to the Q20a b/c they also share a portion of their route (along 20th av) {and also, the fact that they both end in the neighborhoods of college point & jamaica}.

 

I don't know why you bothered to reiterate the same counter-argument I made to you, back at me....

All you did with that was further invalidate your original claim of the Q76 being a bit redundant to the Q20a....

 

 

From 14th, you either gotta:

 

- swing all the way to the van wyck service rd & back west across 20th (nobody's doing that, that's OUT!), or....

- make your way over to that chase bank on 132nd, then down towards the jetro, to 20th.... That block is where the Q76 goes on layover.

(hell, that only gets you to the staples & the waldbaums anyway - hardly the reasons you have as many ppl. taking buses to that mall.)

 

This idea that we're gonna shift Q20 service to 14th & have mall seekers walking from parsons/20th or 14th/132nd is ridiculous....

The primary reason though on why I wanted the Q20A cut instead of the Q20B was that I disagreed with leaving 14 Avenue with no bus service and since the Q76 was already on 20 Avenue, I figured that if it was simply extended to where the Q20 ended, then it woul make up for the loss of the Q20A. But I guess an alternative could be instead having the Q20 use 14 Avenue until 132 Street, then make a left on that street and then a right onto 20 Avenue and would use the Q20A routing from there. The Q76 would do vice-versa. It would make a right onto 132 Street from 20 Avenue and then a left onto 14 Avenue and then travel the remainder of the Q20B's routing. Therefore both buses would still serve the mall and coverage on 14 Avenue isn't lost.

[Q43LTD]

The primary reason though on why I wanted the Q20A cut instead of the Q20B was that I disagreed with leaving 14 Avenue with no bus service and since the Q76 was already on 20 Avenue, I figured that if it was simply extended to where the Q20 ended, then it woul make up for the loss of the Q20A. But I guess an alternative could be instead having the Q20 use 14 Avenue until 132 Street, then make a left on that street and then a right onto 20 Avenue and would use the Q20A routing from there. The Q76 would do vice-versa. It would make a right onto 132 Street from 20 Avenue and then a left onto 14 Avenue and then travel the remainder of the Q20B's routing. Therefore both buses would still serve the mall and coverage on 14 Avenue isn't lost.

Wanna know what's real funny? Back in the old days, there was nothing on 20 Av. The original Q20 ran on 14 Av until 1999.

[Q67 via Borden]

Wanna know what's real funny? Back in the old days, there was nothing on 20 Av. The original Q20 ran on 14 Av until 1999.

Wasn't that before the CP Mall opened? And how was the Q20's ridership back then and it was also the year the Q20 got extended to Jamaica so the Q44 could be converted into a limited route.

[Q43LTD]

Wasn't that before the CP Mall opened? And how was the Q20's ridership back then and it was also the year the Q20 got extended to Jamaica so the Q44 could be converted into a limited route.

Yes it was. I really can't tell you how the ridership of the Q20 was prior to the extension. It couldn't have been no worse than the Q14 or 15.

[Q67 via Borden]

I have got some feedback about the Q103/B32 merger from MTA. They said the following in response:

 

Response By Email (Denise Grey-Stewart) (10/17/2013 08:57 AM)

This is in response to your recent e-mail suggesting the combination of the B32 and Q103 bus routes.

 

MTA New York City Transit and the MTA Bus Company are committed to providing safe, courteous, reliable, and accessible bus service. We forwarded a copy of your suggestion to our Operations Planning for possible future consideration.

 

Thank you for using our online system.

 

Denise Stewart

Associate Staff Analyst

[Q43LTD]

All right. I might do the same for a possible Q34 and 64 extensions.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

I have got some feedback about the Q103/B32 merger from MTA. They said the following in response:

 

Response By Email (Denise Grey-Stewart) (10/17/2013 08:57 AM)

This is in response to your recent e-mail suggesting the combination of the B32 and Q103 bus routes.

 

MTA New York City Transit and the MTA Bus Company are committed to providing safe, courteous, reliable, and accessible bus service. We forwarded a copy of your suggestion to our Operations Planning for possible future consideration.

 

Thank you for using our online system.

 

Denise Stewart

Associate Staff Analyst

That's what they say to everyone, even If I mention extending the Q2 to Queens Plaza they'll still have that same message.

[Q67 via Borden]

That's what they say to everyone, even If I mention extending the Q2 to Queens Plaza they'll still have that same message.

LOL! I But then they with rebutt whoever suggested that HARD! At least combining the B32 and Q103 is realistic, sending the Q2 to QBP isn't.

All right. I might do the same for a possible Q34 and 64 extensions.

Have the Q64 go to Oakland Gardens via 73 Avenue to replace the Q75. Q34 yes extend it to Bay Terrace via QM20's routing and it would also terminate with the QM20 there. But on it's southern end, cut it back to Flushing as no one on Kissena or Parsons actually wants the Q34. A Willets Point Boulevard route is necessary as QM20 only takes people to Manhattan.

[NewFlyer 230]

LOL! I But then they with rebutt whoever suggested that HARD! At least combining the B32 and Q103 is realistic, sending the Q2 to QBP isn't.

 

Have the Q64 go to Oakland Gardens via 73 Avenue to replace the Q75. Q34 yes extend it to Bay Terrace via QM20's routing and it would also terminate with the QM20 there. But on it's southern end, cut it back to Flushing as no one on Kissena or Parsons actually wants the Q34. A Willets Point Boulevard route is necessary as QM20 only takes people to Manhattan.

No I would only have the Q64 go to 188st 64th Ave currently where the Q17 short turns at. Oakland Gardens didn't see that much service anyway. I do remember seeing the Q75 crowded sometimes but they were students and or people who would of taken the Q17 or Q88 if the Q75 didn't show up first. But honestly the Q64 is doing good where it's at along with the QM4.

[Q67 via Borden]

No I would only have the Q64 go to 188st 64th Ave currently where the Q17 short turns at. Oakland Gardens didn't see that much service anyway. I do remember seeing the Q75 crowded sometimes but they were students and or people who would of taken the Q17 or Q88 if the Q75 didn't show up first. But honestly the Q64 is doing good where it's at along with the QM4.

The Q64 extension helps close a service gap on 73 Avenue and gives Fresh Meadows and Oakland Gardens a one seat ride to the QBL subway. No one wanted the Q75 because it was duplicative and infrequent. The Q64 is more frequent and isn't duplicative. And speaking of the Q88 it should become a through HHE route and use the Q30 routing to Little Neck and the Q30 could be eliminated as it is only a supplement to the Q31 until HHE and no one uses it end to end either. Q88 shouldn't have to swing down Springfield Booulevard to QV when the Q27 is avaliable.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

The Q64 extension helps close a service gap on 73 Avenue and gives Fresh Meadows and Oakland Gardens a one seat ride to the QBL subway. No one wanted the Q75 because it was duplicative and infrequent. The Q64 is more frequent and isn't duplicative. And speaking of the Q88 it should become a through HHE route and use the Q30 routing to Little Neck and the Q30 could be eliminated as it is only a supplement to the Q31 until HHE and no one uses it end to end either. Q88 shouldn't have to swing down Springfield Booulevard to QV when the Q27 is avaliable.

No, the Q88 should stay as it is, those reverse peak Q88's that terminate on the HHE at Francis Lewis Blvd are close enough and as good as you're gonna get.

 

The Q88 needs to go on 73 Avenue, and stay there, there are people that use it.

[NewFlyer 230]

The Q64 extension helps close a service gap on 73 Avenue and gives Fresh Meadows and Oakland Gardens a one seat ride to the QBL subway. No one wanted the Q75 because it was duplicative and infrequent. The Q64 is more frequent and isn't duplicative. And speaking of the Q88 it should become a through HHE route and use the Q30 routing to Little Neck and the Q30 could be eliminated as it is only a supplement to the Q31 until HHE and no one uses it end to end either. Q88 shouldn't have to swing down Springfield Booulevard to QV when the Q27 is avaliable.

Didn't that Q90 dude propose that idea about the Q88 going from little Neck to Queens Blvd via Horace Harding Expressway. It's funny because people still use the Q88 until around Hillside Ave. The Q30 is needed because people from Jamaica won't have access to the Queensborough Community College and if the Q31 has 7 days a week service with the Q30's and Q31 headways combined the upper parts like Bayside, Fresh Meadows will be over served. The current system works so why change it if it isn't messed up.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Didn't that Q90 dude propose that idea about the Q88 going from little Neck to Queens Blvd via Horace Harding Expressway. It's funny because people still use the Q88 until around Hillside Ave. The Q30 is needed because people from Jamaica won't have access to the Queensborough Community College and if the Q31 has 7 days a week service with the Q30's and Q31 headways combined the upper parts like Bayside, Fresh Meadows will be over served. The current system works so why change it if it isn't messed up.

Yes and it was a very dumb idea.

[Q67 via Borden]

No, the Q88 should stay as it is, those reverse peak Q88's that terminate on the HHE at Francis Lewis Blvd are close enough and as good as you're gonna get.

 

The Q88 needs to go on 73 Avenue, and stay there, there are people that use it.

The Q64 replaces the Q88 on 73 Avenue plus it actually would be an upgrade for Fresh Meadows and Oakland Gardens since the Q64 connects to the QBL express lines, the Q88 doesn't and it's also more frequent. You'll also see a high number of folks xferring from Q88s to Q30s on the HHE to continue eastward.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

The Q64 replaces the Q88 on 73 Avenue plus it actually would be an upgrade for Fresh Meadows and Oakland Gardens since the Q64 connects to the QBL express lines, the Q88 doesn't and it's also more frequent. You'll also see a high number of folks xferring from Q88s to Q30s on the HHE to continue eastward.

That's not true, I take the Q88 on a daily basis , all the way out to 188, and I see 0 people on the Q88 transfering to the Q30 and vice versa.

 

The riders in Fresh Meadows also get service to Queens College, and the many high schools and educational centers along the Q88 that the Q64 doesn't serve. It's best to leave it alone, both routes are fine, so it isn't a problem.

Edited October 17, 2013 by Q23 Central Terminal

[Q67 via Borden]

Didn't that Q90 dude propose that idea about the Q88 going from little Neck to Queens Blvd via Horace Harding Expressway. It's funny because people still use the Q88 until around Hillside Ave. The Q30 is needed because people from Jamaica won't have access to the Queensborough Community College and if the Q31 has 7 days a week service with the Q30's and Q31 headways combined the upper parts like Bayside, Fresh Meadows will be over served. The current system works so why change it if it isn't messed up.

I guess scratch the Q30 elimination and instead just have it barrel down HHE until Springfield Boulevard and have all buses terminate at QCC since if it still went to Little Neck, it would duplicate the HHE crosstown Q88. HHE crosstown was actually suggested by many people (including me). And those people that use Q88s on Springfield are able to use Q27s instead. The only reason the Q88 swings down to QV is to help out the Q27. As for the Q31, it needs to be taken off Bell Boulevard and instead run on Francis Lewis Boulevard until 32 Avenue where it would then follow the Q28 to the shopping center at Bay Terrace because having it terminate at 27 Avenue/Francis Lewis is nothing but arbitrary (I know B35 via Church suggested this but he wanted the buses to terminate at Corporal Kennedy Street/32 Avenue where Bayside HS is).

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

I guess scratch the Q30 elimination and instead just have it barrel down HHE until Springfield Boulevard and have all buses terminate at QCC since if it still went to Little Neck, it would duplicate the HHE crosstown Q88. HHE crosstown was actually suggested by many people (including me). And those people that use Q88s on Springfield are able to use Q27s instead. The only reason the Q88 swings down to QV is to help out the Q27. As for the Q31, it needs to be taken off Bell Boulevard and instead run on Francis Lewis Boulevard until 32 Avenue where it would then follow the Q28 to the shopping center at Bay Terrace because having it terminate at 27 Avenue/Francis Lewis is nothing but arbitrary (I know B35 via Church suggested this but he wanted the buses to terminate at Corporal Kennedy Street/32 Avenue where Bayside HS is).

Suggested by what many people. I have never heard of such proposal of a Q88 along the full HHE other than you and Q90. It's a miracle how you guys have the same plans all the time.

[Q43LTD]

Making the Q88 a through route on Horace Harding is a bad idea. Passengers east of 188 will not access to Jamaica. Eliminating the Q30 is a bad idea too. It does not duplicate the Q31. Despite the fact the 31 will get its weekend service restored, the 30 is here to stay. I had idea to extend the Q34 to the former Q14 terminal at Clintonville. In the process, the 15A is eliminated and the 34 runs 7 days a week. Weekdays to Jamaica, weekends to Flushing. I am also advocating a Q64 extension to 230 St. Of course this when everything is finally merged.

[Q67 via Borden]

Suggested by what many people. I have never heard of such proposal of a Q88 along the full HHE other than you and Q90. It's a miracle how you guys have the same plans all the time.

Take a look at this then: http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/topic/34293-queens-bus-proposalsideas-thread/page-37

 

 

Same proposals as Q90? Not exactly. He had some stupid ideas like B24 to Ridgewood or sending the B13 to WBP or a bus on Eastern Parkway. It's only particular ideas of his I like but some are ridiculous.

[Q67 via Borden]

Making the Q88 a through route on Horace Harding is a bad idea. Passengers east of 188 will not access to Jamaica. Eliminating the Q30 is a bad idea too. It does not duplicate the Q31. Despite the fact the 31 will get its weekend service restored, the 30 is here to stay. I had idea to extend the Q34 to the former Q14 terminal at Clintonville. In the process, the 15A is eliminated and the 34 runs 7 days a week. Weekdays to Jamaica, weekends to Flushing. I am also advocating a Q64 extension to 230 St. Of course this when everything is finally merged.

The Q30 elimination I scratched since I wasn't thinking straight when I said that. And you're just better off restoring the old Q14 and having the Q34 be a Willets Point crosstown. But no Jamaica because no one in Whitestone or Beechurst wants Jamaica. The Q14 could run along it's former routing but instead of turning off Willets Point at 149 Street, it would turn off at 150 Street so it doesn't parallel the Q15 on another street a block away and uses the Q15A routing to Beechurst. And that is the very same Q64 extension I'm advocating for too. It is an effective replacement of the Q75 in Oakland Gardens.

[bobtehpanda]

Okay, the Q30/Q88 swap/elimination/whatever the hell it is, is an awful idea similar to how a 76/20 swap would be bad.

 

Most people who take buses in Queens are looking for the subway. No one is going to ride the Q88 from Little Neck all the way down to Rego Park - it's faster to go to Jamaica (which is what the Q30 does now). Likewise, no one is going to ride the Q76 to Jamaica, when everybody is looking for Flushing.

 

The network in Eastern Queens is largely adequate, and doesn't really need changes.

[Q67 via Borden]

Okay, the Q30/Q88 swap/elimination/whatever the hell it is, is an awful idea similar to how a 76/20 swap would be bad.

 

Most people who take buses in Queens are looking for the subway. No one is going to ride the Q88 from Little Neck all the way down to Rego Park - it's faster to go to Jamaica (which is what the Q30 does now). Likewise, no one is going to ride the Q76 to Jamaica, when everybody is looking for Flushing.

 

The network in Eastern Queens is largely adequate, and doesn't really need changes.

 

Faster than Jamaica? I'll kindly disagree with that. A Q88 crosstown is actually faster than the Q30 and no one uses the Q30 from Little Neck to Jamaica, Little Neck residents actually tend to go to Flushing. And everyone is looking for Flushing from College Point? I think riders from the Q20, Q25, Q65, and Q76 will have to disagree. If that was the case then not all of those 4 buses wouldn't go from College Point to Jamaica. The Q30 IMO should run between Jamaica and QCC but that's it.

[bobtehpanda]

Faster than Jamaica? I'll kindly disagree with that. A Q88 crosstown is actually faster than the Q30 and no one uses the Q30 from Little Neck to Jamaica,

 

From Jackson Heights-Roosevelt to Little Neck/HHE via the and Q36, travel time is an hour and six minutes during the PM peak. The same journey time using the local trains, Q88, and Q30 takes an hour and ten minutes, and this is assuming that the Q88 is on schedule and not held up by traffic, and the transfers aren't missed.

 

You'd also be screwing over QV riders, since there are a fair amount of people in QV heading to the Fresh Meadows shopping center at 188th.

 

And everyone is looking for Flushing from College Point? I think riders from the Q20, Q25, Q65, and Q76 will have to disagree. If that was the case then not all of those 4 buses wouldn't go from College Point to Jamaica.

 

All of the College Point routes you just mentioned go through Flushing, except the Q76. Guess which of these routes has the lowest frequencies (and for the purpose of this, the Q20 and Q44 are essentially local and limited versions of the same route)? The Q76, because it doesn't go through Flushing.

 

In fact, that's the reason why all the routes except the Q76 and Q31 north of Northern go into Flushing - that's where everyone is headed. The College Point routes also go to Jamaica to provide easier transfer opportunities for those traveling through, and because turning around all those buses in Flushing would be a nightmare (which is a very good reason to not break up the Q34 - there is no street capacity in Flushing for any more bus turnarounds)

[NewFlyer 230]

The Q64 replaces the Q88 on 73 Avenue plus it actually would be an upgrade for Fresh Meadows and Oakland Gardens since the Q64 connects to the QBL express lines, the Q88 doesn't and it's also more frequent. You'll also see a high number of folks xferring from Q88s to Q30s on the HHE to continue eastward.

Don't mess with my home routes. I like the way they are currently. The Q64 is fast and reliable( the only one out of CP that is like that) I use the Q17 or Q88 to travel to school and or different places.

[Q67 via Borden]

Don't mess with my home routes. I like the way they are currently. The Q64 is fast and reliable( the only one out of CP that is like that) I use the Q17 or Q88 to travel to school and or different places.

Why are you against a Q64 extension? Extending that route would help increase it's ridership and close service gaps in Fresh Meadows and Oakland Gardens by helping people get to Queens College and the QBL subway in a quick and reliable way. The extension wouldn't add that much time to the Q64's run time anyways (probably no more than 20 minutes). It's definitely a better idea than bringing back that useless Q75.