Random Thoughts Thread - Nassau Inter-County Express (NICE)

[NY1635]

Or if you live near a major cross-street, take the n40/41, n43, or n81 down to the LIRR.

 

 

I think the idea is so that NICE doesn't have to run any type of service on the n80/81. Riders in North Massapequa would be able to take the n71 and then transfer to the n49 if they need to continue north to Hicksville. (Or maybe make their way to Bethpage or Farmingdale for the LIRR). 

 

As for running down 110, I think the idea is that NICE wants to minimize the amount of mileage within Suffolk. They'd just tell people to take the S1 to the n70. 

 

 

But NICE would also keep the n71 running down Carmans Road to Sunrise Mall for similar reasons. I don't think they're too keen on messing with the routes too much despite the recent suggestions on this board.

 

Hopefully, whoever becomes County Executive after Mangano will try to find a way to fund the bus system, so that Nassau doesn't have random service levels.

Edited February 3, 2017 by NY1635

[checkmatechamp13]

But NICE would also keep the n71 running down Carmans Road to Sunrise Mall for similar reasons. I don't think they're too keen on messing with the routes too much despite the recent suggestions on this board.

 

Hopefully, whoever becomes County Executive after Mangano will try to find a way to fund the bus system, so that Nassau doesn't have random service levels.

 

The thing is that Carmans Road does have the S1 in the general area whereas those parts of North Massapequa basically have nothing.

 

Also I just realized: People can also take the n71 to the S20 as an alternative to the n72 (except Sundays of course)

 

And agreed on your last point.

[Amtrak7]

I'm glad they are keeping the N22A and the full N35, since the westbound N22A gets quite heavy ridership (especially at Willis/Hillside) and the N35 has heavy ridership north of Hempstead especially on days when NCC is in session.  (When you're cutting the N45 and N51 that go to NCC, you need to rely on the N16, N43 and N35 to pick up the slack now.)

 

If they had to make cuts, they're making cuts that affect the fewest number of people.

 

Yeah, I agree that cutting the n35 back at Hempstead or RFM, especially when NCC is in session, is a bad idea.

But does it really need to go past NCC? Every little bit of route mileage can save a lot of money, especially on a route with a decent span of service like the n35.

 

Hopefully, whoever becomes County Executive after Mangano will try to find a way to fund the bus system, so that Nassau doesn't have random service levels.

Agreed. Mangano's indicted and even if he does run again I don't think he'll win. Veolia's got the contract until 2021 (I think).

Edited February 3, 2017 by Amtrak7

[N4 Via Merrick Rd]

I still don't understand why the N19 is on the list. Sometimes I'm there to see the 8:30AM from Freeport and almost every seat is taken by the time it leaves.

 

 

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[Mtatransit]

The LIRR is only $3 from Freelort to Babylon. NICE probably determined that they could take the train

[NY1635]

 

Yeah, I agree that cutting the n35 back at Hempstead or RFM, especially when NCC is in session, is a bad idea.

But does it really need to go past NCC? Every little bit of route mileage can save a lot of money, especially on a route with a decent span of service like the n35.

 

 

Agreed. Mangano's indicted and even if he does run again I don't think he'll win. Veolia's got the contract until 2021 (I think).

 

There's still people who use the n35 to get to the Mall, and don't want to wait the extra few minutes at the HTC for the n15 to show up. NCC students also prefer the 35 because it's routing along Stewart Ave between the Mall and Selfridge is much more direct than the n16, or the n6x.

[N4 Via Merrick Rd]

There's still people who use the n35 to get to the Mall, and don't want to wait the extra few minutes at the HTC for the n15 to show up. NCC students also prefer the 35 because it's routing along Stewart Ave between the Mall and Selfridge is much more direct than the n16, or the n6x.

Yup, the 35 is usually arrives a few seconds behind the 6X at Hempstead.

 

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[67thAve]

One idea I had to balance passenger load between Hempstead and Roosevelt Field/NCC is to do the following:

 

-Mid-day n6x trips to/from NCC would be eliminated.

-The n15 would run via the current n16 route to Roosevelt Field. County Seat Drive service would also be eliminated as part of this.

-The n16 would run via Clinton Road to Roosevelt Field, then down Stewart Avenue, and would terminate at the East Campus bus loop.

-The n35 would remain as-is in terms of alignment, but instead of every other mid-day trip turning back at Hempstead, those trips would terminate at East Campus loop.

 

Pros of this plan include:

-Balanced frequencies via Clinton Road (every 15 minutes with the n16/n35 combined)

-Probable cost savings (I'd imagine that even by extending some mid-day n35 trips, money would be saved by eliminated the n15 via County Seat as well as mid-day NCC service via the n6x)

-Improved service to NCC campus (currently, service to Hempstead is six buses per hour mid-day, this would increase the amount to seven buses per hour).

-Less bunching of buses at NCC (currently, the n6x and n16 arrive within minutes of each other, for example)

 

Cons of this plan include:

-No more County Seat Drive service (This could cause some more crowding on rush hour n40/41 trips.)
-Slightly longer trip times to/from Hempstead

-Increased unreliability of n15 service (It's already a long route, and adding a big ridership generator will probably make things worse. However, need be, the n15 could probably sustain artics, as it has much more ridership south of Hempstead than the n16).

-NCC students will need to walk a few extra minutes depending on where they are on campus for more frequent service (they're gonna be quite annoyed if they typically use the Student Union stop.)

-Some trips at times during which classes start/finish (such as around 1:40 PM on Monday/Wednesday) will probably be overcrowded due to the more evenly spaced timing

Edited February 3, 2017 by MrBeardedBread

[FamousNYLover]

NICE Bus giving wrong detour bus stop information again for Chinese Lunar New Year Parade. Last and first stop is not Bowne St/Sanford Av. all n20G last and first stops were made at Sanford Av-41st Av!

 

 

 

This video was 2016 Feb Lunar New Year Parade when it stated bus will make first stop at eastbound Sanford Av/Parosns Blvd, but it was wrong. n20G wasn't making pickup there.

I made video of NICE Bus Mistake.

 

Edited February 3, 2017 by FamousNYLover

[N4 Via Merrick Rd]

One idea I had to balance passenger load between Hempstead and Roosevelt Field/NCC is to do the following:

 

-Mid-day n6x trips to/from NCC would be eliminated.

-The n15 would run via the current n16 route to Roosevelt Field. County Seat Drive service would also be eliminated as part of this.

-The n16 would run via Clinton Road to Roosevelt Field, then down Stewart Avenue, and would terminate at the East Campus bus loop.

-The n35 would remain as-is in terms of alignment, but instead of every other mid-day trip turning back at Hempstead, those trips would terminate at East Campus loop.

 

Pros of this plan include:

-Balanced frequencies via Clinton Road (every 15 minutes with the n16/n35 combined)

-Probable cost savings (I'd imagine that even by extending some mid-day n35 trips, money would be saved by eliminated the n15 via County Seat as well as mid-day NCC service via the n6x)

-Improved service to NCC campus (currently, service to Hempstead is six buses per hour mid-day, this would increase the amount to seven buses per hour).

-Less bunching of buses at NCC (currently, the n6x and n16 arrive within minutes of each other, for example)

 

Cons of this plan include:

-No more County Seat Drive service (This could cause some more crowding on rush hour n40/41 trips.)

-Slightly longer trip times to/from Hempstead

-Increased unreliability of n15 service (It's already a long route, and adding a big ridership generator will probably make things worse. However, need be, the n15 could probably sustain artics, as it has much more ridership south of Hempstead than the n16).

-NCC students will need to walk a few extra minutes depending on where they are on campus for more frequent service (they're gonna be quite annoyed if they typically use the Student Union stop.)

-Some trips at times during which classes start/finish (such as around 1:40 PM on Monday/Wednesday) will probably be overcrowded due to the more evenly spaced timing

Also, the DSS stop is also another choke point on the route. The midday 6X trips tend to pick up a lot of riders. I rode the 12:40 trip to NCC, it was standing room only. I'd have the 6X start going to Jamaica every 40 minutes as opposed to terminating at Hempstead. Also, to mitigate the crowding on the n6 during the midday.

 

Those n24 trips to East Meadow should be routed to serve the college instead. A one seat ride from Mineola to NCC.

[RtrainBlues]

The N15 should be left alone as if you make the route longer, you will make reliability and bunching problems worsen.  There's a reason why the N16 makes the long circuitous detour to NCC and Social Services instead, and that's because it's a shorter route. 

 

Also, they might have considered dropping the N54 and keeping the N79 instead.  Since you'll have an N55 (instead of N54) and N79 (instead of N78).  Would keep everyone happy.

[checkmatechamp13]

Also, the DSS stop is also another choke point on the route. The midday 6X trips tend to pick up a lot of riders. I rode the 12:40 trip to NCC, it was standing room only. I'd have the 6X start going to Jamaica every 40 minutes as opposed to terminating at Hempstead. Also, to mitigate the crowding on the n6 during the midday.

 

Those n24 trips to East Meadow should be routed to serve the college instead. A one seat ride from Mineola to NCC.

 

With artics coming to the n6, I doubt you'll see the n6X midday trips extended any time soon.

[FamousNYLover]

My updated suggestion.

n1: Eliminate peak Jamaica trip. Hewlett service is needed.

Elmont Flexi: Every hour rush hour, small van.

n4/4X: Current.

Rockville Centre Community Shuttle: Eliminate

n15: Implement n15X trip. n15X will only make limited stops between Long Beach and Hempstead, stopping at Mercy Medical Center,  and all n15/15X trips will operate via Garden City routing between Hempstead and Roosevelt Field Mall. n15X rush hours only. n15 24-hour.

n16: Eliminate Saturday.

Mercy Medical Community Shuttle: Eliminate.and replace by n15X.

n19: Keep it. Implement Sunday service on S20 Loop using small van.

n20G/H: Restore back to direct n20 bus service between Hicksville and Flushing via Great Neck.

n21: Rush Hour Only.

n22: 24-hour.

n23: 24-hour.

n24: East Meadow branch eliminated.

n25: More hours needed.

n26: Eliminate.

n27: Operate between Glen Cove and Roosevelt Field Mall.

n28: Restore and implement Roslyn Station, serving Roslyn Industiral Park, Harbor Link Golf Course, Amsterdam at Harborside, and Helen Killer Blind Center Sandy Points.

n31: Rush Hour only.

n32: 24-hour.

n33: 24-hour with 90 minutes headway after last weekday bus.

n35: 24-hour. Extend to Amber Court and Home Depot on Jericho Turnpike during rush hours.

n36: Needed or operate as Summer Service Only.

n40: 24-hour.

n41: Needed.

n45: Needed. Use small van service.

n51:: Eliminate

n54: Keep as it is.

n55: Rush hour only.

n57: All rush hour trips operate clockwise loop.

n58: Eliminate US Merchant House.

Freeport Community Shuttle:Elimante

n70: Hempstead-Farmingdale State University.

n71:

n72: Implement n72 to operate limited-stop during rush hour between Hempstead and NYS 110, stopping at major stop. Other time local stops between Hempstead and Babylon Train Station.

Hicksville-Wantagh Community Shuttle: Use small van.

n78: Eliinate.

n79: More service to meet mall hours. n79 will serve Plainnview loop both direction.

n80: Merge to n81.

n81: Use smaller van.

n88: Needed. Restore Theater service.

Edited February 4, 2017 by FamousNYLover

[N6 Limited]

Many times the Westbound N1 is able to pick up people west of Elmont Road that get flagged by packed N6 buses.  There are mornings where people have been flagged by Jamaica bound N1 and N6 buses. They may consider cutting peak N1 service when Artics go into service though

[NY1635]

My updated suggestion.

n1: Eliminate peak Jamaica trip. Hewlett service is needed.

Elmont Flexi: Every hour rush hour, small van.

n4/4X: Current.

Rockville Centre Community Shuttle: Eliminate

n15: Implement n15X trip. n15X will only make limited stops between Long Beach and Hempstead, stopping at Mercy Medical Center,  and all n15/15X trips will operate via Garden City routing between Hempstead and Roosevelt Field Mall. n15X rush hours only. n15 24-hour.

n16: Eliminate Saturday.

Mercy Medical Community Shuttle: Eliminate.and replace by n15X.

n19: Keep it. Implement Sunday service on S20 Loop using small van.

n20G/H: Restore back to direct n20 bus service between Hicksville and Flushing via Great Neck.

n21: Rush Hour Only.

n22: 24-hour.

n23: 24-hour.

n24: East Meadow branch eliminated.

n25: More hours needed.

n26: Eliminate.

n27: Operate between Glen Cove and Roosevelt Field Mall.

n28: Restore and implement Roslyn Station, serving Roslyn Industiral Park, Harbor Link Golf Course, Amsterdam at Harborside, and Helen Killer Blind Center Sandy Points.

n31: Rush Hour only.

n32: 24-hour.

n33: 24-hour with 90 minutes headway after last weekday bus.

n35: 24-hour. Extend to Amber Court and Home Depot on Jericho Turnpike during rush hours.

n36: Needed or operate as Summer Service Only.

n40: 24-hour.

n41: Needed.

n45: Needed. Use small van service.

n51:: Eliminate

n54: Keep as it is.

n55: Rush hour only.

n57: All rush hour trips operate clockwise loop.

n58: Eliminate US Merchant House.

Freeport Community Shuttle:Elimante

n70: Hempstead-Farmingdale State University.

n71:

n72: Implement n72 to operate limited-stop during rush hour between Hempstead and NYS 110, stopping at major stop. Other time local stops between Hempstead and Babylon Train Station.

Hicksville-Wantagh Community Shuttle: Use small van.

n78: Eliinate.

n79: More service to meet mall hours. n79 will serve Plainnview loop both direction.

n80: Merge to n81.

n81: Use smaller van.

n88: Needed. Restore Theater service.

 

Most of the routes listed don't need full 24 hour service. I think the n15's need at least running between Rockville Center and Long Beach, the n40 between Freeport and Hempstead, and the n22/24 between Mineola and Jamaica.

 

I also disagree with reconnecting the n20 and having it run full route between Hicksville and Flushing. It should terminate at either Roslyn LIRR, or Old Westbury.

Edited February 4, 2017 by NY1635

[Mtatransit]

My updated suggestion.                  My response in bold

n1: Eliminate peak Jamaica trip. Hewlett service is needed. Peak Jamaica service is crowded, N1 after green Acre is not

Elmont Flexi: Every hour rush hour, small van. 

n4/4X: Current. I still believe there should be some n4 Local short turns during rush hours

Rockville Centre Community Shuttle: Eliminate

n15: Implement n15X trip. n15X will only make limited stops between Long Beach and Hempstead, stopping at Mercy Medical Center,  and all n15/15X trips will operate via Garden City routing between Hempstead and Roosevelt Field Mall. n15X rush hours only. n15 24-hour. n15X more expensive than Mercy Shuttle, n15 does not warrant 24 hours

n16: Eliminate Saturday.

Mercy Medical Community Shuttle: Eliminate.and replace by n15X.

n19: Keep it. Implement Sunday service on S20 Loop using small van. n19 could be eliminated due to LIRR alternative and similar fares

n20G/H: Restore back to direct n20 bus service between Hicksville and Flushing via Great Neck. Splitting the route caused both n20G and n20H to become more reliable, I would keep it as is, maybe the limited could be restored rush hour

n21: Rush Hour Only. Rerouted to serve Glen Cove via Glen Cove road(n27)

n22: 24-hour. Maybe 24 hour service is warranted skipping Roosevelt Field,but I doubt it due to lack of connection

n23: 24-hour. n23 does not need 24 hour service

n24: East Meadow branch eliminated. Weekend Service should all end at Roosevelt Field, I rode it a couple weekend, by the time the bus gets to the Source the bus is almost empty 

n25: More hours needed. Maybe one more hour on weekend but weekday service enough

n26: Eliminate. n26 should be kept, to provide north shore rider a one seat to Jamaica

n27: Operate between Glen Cove and Roosevelt Field Mall. Service should be 60 min all day

n28: Restore and implement Roslyn Station, serving Roslyn Industiral Park, Harbor Link Golf Course, Amsterdam at Harborside, and Helen Killer Blind Center Sandy Points. Van service may work here

n31: Rush Hour only.

n32: 24-hour. 24 Hour service not needed

n33: 24-hour with 90 minutes headway after last weekday bus. Service should be transferred, eliminated or reduced to hourly rush hours.

n35: 24-hour. Extend to Amber Court and Home Depot on Jericho Turnpike during rush hours. n35 should really be weekdays only, with rush hour service to Westbury

n36: Needed or operate as Summer Service Only. Eliminate (n4) alternative

n40: 24-hour. n40 could become 24 hour, that I will agree with

n41: Needed.

n45: Needed. Use small van service. I would route it via n45 to Camp/Merrick down n51 to serve and end at Merrick Station

n51:: Eliminate

n54: Keep as it is. n54 should be Rush Hours only

n55: Rush hour only.  n55 should be full time ending at Sunrise

n57: All rush hour trips operate clockwise loop. Van Service could work here

n58: Eliminate US Merchant House. 

Freeport Community Shuttle:Elimante

n70: Hempstead-Farmingdale State University.

n71: Service could be eliminated between Sunrise Mall and Farmingdale

n72: Implement n72 to operate limited-stop during rush hour between Hempstead and NYS 110, stopping at major stop. Other time local stops between Hempstead and Babylon Train Station. Bus pretty fast along this corrider of Hpstd Tpk, no need for limited Service. Babylon Service could be eliminated

Hicksville-Wantagh Community Shuttle: Use small van.

n78: Eliinate.

n79: More service to meet mall hours. n79 will serve Plainnview loop both direction. n79 really emptys out after it turns off Old Country Rd, I would keep it between Woodbury and Hicksville

n80: Merge to n81.

n81: Use smaller van. Saturday service should be eliminated

n88: Needed. Restore Theater service. Theater Service expensive, better sidewalk at Jones Beach will provide more benefit 

[Amtrak7]

This is the NICE labor contract with TWU 252 that expires this year: http://twulocal252.org/sites/default/files/transdev_contract.pdf

 

Of note, this explains why there is such a big difference between Saturday and Sunday service. A driver's two off days a week need not be consecutive if one of them is Sunday.

Edited February 4, 2017 by Amtrak7

[B35 via Church]

My updated suggestion.....

n71:

In all your years on these transit forums, I must admit that this is, bar none, the Best idea I've seen out of you.....

[Joel Up Front]

Many times the Westbound N1 is able to pick up people west of Elmont Road that get flagged by packed N6 buses.  There are mornings where people have been flagged by Jamaica bound N1 and N6 buses. They may consider cutting peak N1 service when Artics go into service though

 

Do you remember anything of the old N2 and N3 when they followed the N1 and N6 to Jamaica during the rush?

[N6 Limited]

Do you remember anything of the old N2 and N3 when they followed the N1 and N6 to Jamaica during the rush?

The N2 and N3 were useful.  If you were flagged by the N1 or N6 you could always get on the N2 or N3, they usually had room available. Sometimes they'd have a full seated load especially the N2(which had standees at times). The N3 wasn't as full most of the time.

 

I just found two schedules Effective June 22, 2003:

 

The N2 had 6 trips to Jamaica in the Morning, 5 from Jamaica in the evening.

 

Starting at N Fletcher Ave and VS State Park Entrance:

 

6:14 Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 6:50

6:26 Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 7:04

6:47 Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 7:25

7:01 Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 7:39

7:19 Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 7:59

7:42 Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 8:22 

 

From Jamaica to Valley Stream:

4:51 Arrived in Valley Stream at  5:30

5:25 Arrived in Valley Stream at  6:04

5:58 Arrived in Valley Stream at  6:36

6:20 Arrived in Valley Stream at  6:58

6:52 Arrived in Valley Stream at  7:29

 

 

The N3 had 3 runs to Jamaica in the Morning, 3 runs from Jamaica in the evening.

 

Starting in Malverne at Franklin Ave & Hempstead Ave:

 

6:18  Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 7:01

6:46  Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 7:29

7:16  Arrived at Jamaica Bus Terminal at 8:02

 

Malverne bound N3 from Jamaica Bus Terminal:

 

5:21 Arrived in Malverne at  6:08

5:55 Arrived in Malverne at  6:42

6:27 Arrived in Malverne at  7:13

[Gotham Bus Co.]

My updated suggestion.

 

 

Suggestions don't really matter because NICE will provide only as much service as Nassau County is willing to pay for.

Edited February 5, 2017 by Gotham Bus Co.

[NY1635]

I have my own list of suggestions.

 

Elmont Flexi: Travels along Rockaway Parkway/Avenue in Valley Stream to Corona Avenue

Mercy Medical Shuttle: Terminal moved to Merrick/Park Avenue. (It's worth a shot)

n43: extended from Freeport to Bellmore LIRR via Merrick Road during Weekday Rush Hour.

n48/49: Reconnect the Jericho Quad Shuttle with the n48.

[67thAve]

I have my own list of suggestions.

 

Elmont Flexi: Travels along Rockaway Parkway/Avenue in Valley Stream to Corona Avenue

Mercy Medical Shuttle: Terminal moved to Merrick/Park Avenue. (It's worth a shot)

n43: extended from Freeport to Bellmore LIRR via Merrick Road during Weekday Rush Hour.

n48/49: Reconnect the Jericho Quad Shuttle with the n48.

 

 

I can agree with that idea for the Elmont Flexi. Rockaway is a faster, straighter road than Corona, is closer to more residences/businesses, as well as only a block away from the current route, so current riders don't need to walk much further.

 

As for the other three:

 

-With the Mercy Medical Shuttle, why would you extend it all the way to Merrick? It's quite a long ways away, and I don't see how the shuttle will gain much more in terms of riders.

-The n43 could probably be extended during rush hours to Bellmore, but with the current budget situation, I doubt that would happen.

-I'd personally cut the Jericho Quad leg of the n48. If it MUST be kept, I would certainly switch to utilizing minibuses.

[Mtatransit]

I can agree with that idea for the Elmont Flexi. Rockaway is a faster, straighter road than Corona, is closer to more residences/businesses, as well as only a block away from the current route, so current riders don't need to walk much further.

 

As for the other three:

 

-With the Mercy Medical Shuttle, why would you extend it all the way to Merrick? It's quite a long ways away, and I don't see how the shuttle will gain much more in terms of riders.

-The n43 could probably be extended during rush hours to Bellmore, but with the current budget situation, I doubt that would happen.

-I'd personally cut the Jericho Quad leg of the n48. If it MUST be kept, I would certainly switch to utilizing minibuses.

n81 should be extended to Quad (minibus). MMC Shuttle could be eliminated Edited February 6, 2017 by Mtatransit

[N4 Via Merrick Rd]

I can agree with that idea for the Elmont Flexi. Rockaway is a faster, straighter road than Corona, is closer to more residences/businesses, as well as only a block away from the current route, so current riders don't need to walk much further.

 

As for the other three:

 

-With the Mercy Medical Shuttle, why would you extend it all the way to Merrick? It's quite a long ways away, and I don't see how the shuttle will gain much more in terms of riders.

-The n43 could probably be extended during rush hours to Bellmore, but with the current budget situation, I doubt that would happen.

-I'd personally cut the Jericho Quad leg of the n48. If it MUST be kept, I would certainly switch to utilizing minibuses.

I think it's Merrick Road/Park Av in RVC. To avoid having to cross Sunrise Hwy.

 

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N43:

-6:55 AM from Freeport to RF should be scheduled to leave at 7:00 AM to allow time for passengers on the N4 which arrives at 6:55 AM at Freeport.

-There should be 3-4 N43 Limited runs in the morning from 7AM to 9AM towards NCC and 4 to 5 in the PM from 3-5PM towards Freeport making Local stops between Roosevelt Field and NCC then stops at

-Hempstead Turnpike

-Front Street

-Jerusalem Ave

-Pennywood Ave

-Freeport LIRR

These runs will leave Freeport 7-10 minutes before the local. From NCC to Freeport can take up to 45 minutes alone. It's an idea worth trying. There's a lack of Limited-Stop service on the North South routes.

Elmont Flexi: Reduce to hourly.

FCS: Eliminate

 

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