BUS - Random Thoughts Thread

[dkupf]

Does anybody know the details of the bus schedule changes for September?

[Transit Enthusiast]

BREAKING NEWS:

 

Starting 9/24/2023, the Bx18A/B, M116, B60, Q4 and S46/96 Limited will become pilot FARE FREE routes. This is expected to last until 3/30/2024.

Your thoughts?

[Calvin]

Later to this year, the MTA will be rolling out a fare-free pilot on those routes that’ll last at least 6-12 months.

B60 in Brooklyn, Bx18A/B in the Bronx, M116 in Manhattan, Q4/Limited in Queens and the S46/S96 Limited in Staten Island. 

Edited July 17, 2023 by Calvin

[Lawrence St]

15 minutes ago, Transit Enthusiast said:

BREAKING NEWS:

 

Starting 9/24/2023, the Bx18A/B, M116, B60, Q4 and S46/96 Limited will become pilot FARE FREE routes. This is expected to last until 3/30/2024.

Your thoughts?

Ugh. This will be a disaster.

[40 to 241st]

26 minutes ago, Transit Enthusiast said:

BREAKING NEWS:

 

Starting 9/24/2023, the Bx18A/B, M116, B60, Q4 and S46/96 Limited will become pilot FARE FREE routes. This is expected to last until 3/30/2024.

Your thoughts?

This will be interesting I like that’s they did it one route per borough. I hope they won’t try to take money out of peoples bills and rent I don’t think they’ll though.

[Jdog14]

1 hour ago, 40 to 241st said:

This will be interesting I like that’s they did it one route per borough. I hope they won’t try to take money out of peoples bills and rent I don’t think they’ll though.

How else do you think this will be paid for? Nothing is free. 

[Q43LTD]

What a shock. They didn't pick a former pbl

[The TransitMan]

5 hours ago, Transit Enthusiast said:

BREAKING NEWS:

 

Starting 9/24/2023, the Bx18A/B, M116, B60, Q4 and S46/96 Limited will become pilot FARE FREE routes. This is expected to last until 3/30/2024.

Your thoughts?

Bx18 A/B...by promoting this route and creating an "A/B" version...doesn't surprise me.

M116...ok?

B60...like I said before, this route has been free for years...especially on the Canarsie side from Rockaway Pkwy to Canarsie.

Q4...so that means Q4, Q5, Q84 and Q85 are free. Very dangerous having a "corridor" route as a free route.

S46/S96...eh

[MysteriousBtrain]

23 minutes ago, The TransitMan said:

Bx18 A/B...by promoting this route and creating an "A/B" version...doesn't surprise me.

M116...ok?

B60...like I said before, this route has been free for years...especially on the Canarsie side from Rockaway Pkwy to Canarsie.

Q4...so that means Q4, Q5, Q84 and Q85 are free. Very dangerous having a "corridor" route as a free route.

S46/S96...eh

What's funny is that it was previously announced that no route that "duplicates another" could qualify under the free fare program.

.... Which is what the Q4/M116 technically do.

[Lil 57]

1 hour ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

What's funny is that it was previously announced that no route that "duplicates another" could qualify under the free fare program.

.... Which is what the Q4/M116 technically do.

The S46/96 also does this with the S44/94 being a block or two away form the route for a good part of the eastern portion, between Morningstar Road and Bard Ave.

Seems like the  choose feeder routes since most riders would already be transferring to the subway/another bus route so the amount of money lost on fares isn’t as much.

The Bx18A/B acts as a feeder to the  , the Q4 acts as a feeder to the  and the S46/96 acts as a feeder to the Staten Island Ferry which connects to several subway and bus lines in lower Manhattan.

When it comes to the Q4 I can see people passing up the Q5/84/85  between Jamaica Center and  Linden Blvd and crowding on to Q4 buses, negatively affecting people needing to take the Q4 to destinations east of Merrick/Linden after getting off the train.

 

 

Edited July 18, 2023 by Lil 57

[Transit Enthusiast]

1 hour ago, The TransitMan said:

Bx18 A/B...by promoting this route and creating an "A/B" version...doesn't surprise me.

M116...ok?

B60...like I said before, this route has been free for years...especially on the Canarsie side from Rockaway Pkwy to Canarsie.

Q4...so that means Q4, Q5, Q84 and Q85 are free. Very dangerous having a "corridor" route as a free route.

S46/S96...eh

I'm surprised the MTA chose the Q4 to be Fare Free, and not the more busier Q5 (or 85).

For the S46/S96, I thought it would have been something else, like the S40/90 (Amazon) or either of the S44/94 or S61/91 (the Staten Island Mall Routes), or the S53 (Bay Ridge) maybe.

Bx18A/B? The MTA split this route into two during the redesign, then created an A/B. I'll see how Morris Heights and University Heights handle this.

M116? Maybe. We'll see how this goes. Could have been something else.

B60? Since it parallels the for most of it's run, it really wasn't surprising. Neighborhoods like Brownsville and Canarsie will love this.

 

Maybe if I ride all of these routes during this Free period, I'll get an idea on how it will really work.

[R32 3838]

48 minutes ago, Lil 57 said:

The S46/96 also does this with the S44/94 being a block or two away form the route for a good part of the eastern portion, between Morningstar Road and Bard Ave.

Seems like the  choose feeder routes since most riders would already be transferring to the subway/another bus route so the amount of money lost on fares isn’t as much.

The Bx18A/B acts as a feeder to the  , the Q4 acts as a feeder to the  and the S46/96 acts as a feeder to the Staten Island Ferry which connects to several subway and bus lines in lower Manhattan.

When it comes to the Q4 I can see people passing up the Q5/84/85  between Jamaica Center and  Linden Blvd and crowding on to Q4 buses, negatively affecting people needing to take the Q4 to destinations east of Merrick/Linden after getting off the train.

 

 

This is exactly going to happen. As someone who rode these routes for 28 and a half straight years, Everyone is going to crowd the Q4 within that area and that portion of the route gets a decent chunk of ridership.

[Lil 57]

5 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

This is exactly going to happen. As someone who rode these routes for 28 and a half straight years, Everyone is going to crowd the Q4 within that area and that portion of the route gets a decent chunk of ridership.

The  should send a reminder that transfers are still free between the subway and buses so if you’re going to/from the subway no matter what bus you board, it will still be the same fare. Only thing that changes is how many times you need to swipe/dip/tap your card.

[N6 Limited]

2 hours ago, Lil 57 said:

The  should send a reminder that transfers are still free between the subway and buses so if you’re going to/from the subway no matter what bus you board, it will still be the same fare. Only thing that changes is how many times you need to swipe/dip/tap your card.

Kinda sorta, the free transfer is now available for another route.

 

3 hours ago, Transit Enthusiast said:

I'm surprised the MTA chose the Q4 to be Fare Free, and not the more busier Q5 (or 85).

The Q5 gets turnover all along Merrick, they’d lose money and probably would have to increase service. 

————

The Q4 is proposed to be limited on Merrick Blvd, what if its a ploy to speed up bus service,  remove stops and decrease Q84 service?

Does anyone think this will affect (mainly increase) ridership at St. Albans LIRR ?

 

Edited July 18, 2023 by N6 Limited

[Cait Sith]

2 hours ago, N6 Limited said:

Does anyone think this will affect (mainly increase) ridership at St. Albans LIRR ?

 

Not in the slightest.

Edited July 18, 2023 by Cait Sith

[B35 via Church]

14 hours ago, Transit Enthusiast said:

BREAKING NEWS:

 

Starting 9/24/2023, the Bx18A/B, M116, B60, Q4 and S46/96 Limited will become pilot FARE FREE routes. This is expected to last until 3/30/2024.

Your thoughts?

I could not care less which routes they're randomly (or otherwise choosing) to be free for any sort of "pilot" program.... AFAIC, this is all ultimately setting up for something sinister & I don't like it one bit.... Same thought process goes to/for any other transit providers promoting these fare free stints lately....

Not that I regularly ride any of these routes, but out of GP, I just might go out of my way to avoid these routes, come 9/24 or whatever.....

3 hours ago, N6 Limited said:

Does anyone think this will affect (mainly increase) ridership at St. Albans LIRR ?

No real reason for it to.

8 hours ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

What's funny is that it was previously announced that no route that "duplicates another" could qualify under the free fare program.

.... Which is what the Q4/M116 technically do.

 Lol.... The MTA doesn't even follow their own loading guidelines.... They do what they want.

Edited July 18, 2023 by B35 via Church

[67thAve]

4 hours ago, N6 Limited said:

Kinda sorta, the free transfer is now available for another route.

 

The Q5 gets turnover all along Merrick, they’d lose money and probably would have to increase service. 

————

The Q4 is proposed to be limited on Merrick Blvd, what if its a ploy to speed up bus service,  remove stops and decrease Q84 service?

Does anyone think this will affect (mainly increase) ridership at St. Albans LIRR ?

 

Probably not, but ridership at St. Albans is definitely higher now than it was pre-Atlantic Ticket.

People are clearly willing to pay a bit more (if they can afford it) for a faster and more comfortable commute.

Edited July 18, 2023 by 67thAve

[NBTA]

Might as well make every Bronx and SI route free with the way people walk past the bus operator. Lol

[Lil 57]

10 hours ago, Transit Enthusiast said:

For the S46/S96, I thought it would have been something else, like the S40/90 (Amazon) or either of the S44/94 or S61/91 (the Staten Island Mall Routes), or the S53 (Bay Ridge) maybe.

The S40/90 duplicates the S44/94 from the ferry to Richmond Terrace/Lafayette Ave.

The S44/94 also duplicates the S59 from the Port Richmond area to the Staten Island Mall.

The S61/91 duplicates the S62/92 from the ferry to Victory/Bradley.

But given how the  didn’t follow that guideline for the Q4 who knows?

The S53 would’ve been your best bet given that it doesn’t really duplicate any routes plus is one of the highest ridership routes in the borough. 

Edited July 18, 2023 by Lil 57

[40 to 241st]

19 hours ago, Jdog14 said:

How else do you think this will be paid for? Nothing is free. 

We already pay bills just to let the government fund these buses so imagine them adding money to our bills because of that. So I think they should use the money that we’re using currently to help the government fund the buses and not add more. 

[Jdog14]

4 hours ago, 40 to 241st said:

We already pay bills just to let the government fund these buses so imagine them adding money to our bills because of that. So I think they should use the money that we’re using currently to help the government fund the buses and not add more. 

Doesn't matter. The current money used is only funding the current service. More service (or in this case more cost cause there is zero fare collection) means more money. 

[Calvin]

I seen a passenger with a bike on the S53 (a bike rack route: S53/93 Limited) at Bay Ridge-86 St. Before getting on the bus, the passenger with the bike placed the equipment itself on to the rack before boarding the bus. I wonder, if there was a S53 or 93 Limited without a bike rack and that passenger has a bike itself, are they forced to have to wait for the next bus itself? Or that there's an exception to that part like folding bikes allowed. 

Edited July 19, 2023 by Calvin

[Mtatransit]

Some of the services listed above are already "fare optional". I mean how many people actually pay for the S46 that is not already coming from Whitehall? probably closer to 0 than 50%

13 hours ago, 40 to 241st said:

We already pay bills just to let the government fund these buses so imagine them adding money to our bills because of that. So I think they should use the money that we’re using currently to help the government fund the buses and not add more. 

Current taxes provides the service. If you want free fare, MTA still gets the money, instead of from you directly, from the government, which gets the additional money needed from you indirectly

So you pay extra no matter what

[Mtatransit]

16 hours ago, Lil 57 said:

The S53 would’ve been your best bet given that it doesn’t really duplicate any routes plus is one of the highest ridership routes in the borough. 

The MTA gets what 15 million no matter what. Why would they shoot themselves by choosing the busiest?

In fact if it were up to me I'll choose the least busiest, like the Bx24 or something

Edited July 19, 2023 by Mtatransit

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

22 hours ago, Lil 57 said:

The S40/90 duplicates the S44/94 from the ferry to Richmond Terrace/Lafayette Ave.

The S44/94 also duplicates the S59 from the Port Richmond area to the Staten Island Mall.

The S61/91 duplicates the S62/92 from the ferry to Victory/Bradley.

But given how the  didn’t follow that guideline for the Q4 who knows?

The S53 would’ve been your best bet given that it doesn’t really duplicate any routes plus is one of the highest ridership routes in the borough. 

 

6 hours ago, Mtatransit said:

The MTA gets what 15 million no matter what. Why would they shoot themselves by choosing the busiest?

In fact if it were up to me I'll choose the least busiest, like the Bx24 or something

From the routes chosen, it's evident that the MTA chose routes that predominantly serve lower-income neighborhoods. The least busiest routes (speaking about riders per trip and to some extent, sheer ridership) tend to be in more wealthier areas, like the Bx24. However they also didn't want to pick routes that tend to carry or serve too many areas. 

If they followed that, I guess they could have gone with the Q83 for the Queens route since there's less overlap, but I have no idea what their rationale is. They tend to use any type of argument, which can often conflict with previously made ones, as long as it supports whatever decision they're making.