SUBWAY - Random Thoughts Topic

[DaPr03]

2 hours ago, VIP said:

It looks photoshopped…

To be surprising, it's actually real.

[R32 3838]

2 hours ago, VIP said:

It makes sense, but down here if it makes sense-it doesn’t happen. Queens Boulevard (Jamaica yard) is going to have 1 fleet and that’s the R160’s. Doubt they’re gonna want to spend money and time switching out trains when the R211 will do the same as the 160’s… serve as CBTC operable trains. If the 211’s go to Jamaica for the busiest lines, I don’t see personnel specifically keeping the R211’s off the  

 

They were slated to get the R211s for a long time. They aren't going to put brand new trains on a Part time . If it has open gangways, They will go to Jamaica for that alone. I know TA is stupid but not that stupid. Giving Coney Island R211s wouldn't make any sense anyway and the only reason they would probably get them is because of politics. 

 

When a new car order comes in, Cars get swapped all the time so Jamaica could lose 40 to 50% of their R160s back to coney.

[darkstar8983]

4 hours ago, VIP said:

It makes sense, but down here if it makes sense-it doesn’t happen. Queens Boulevard (Jamaica yard) is going to have 1 fleet and that’s the R160’s. Doubt they’re gonna want to spend money and time switching out trains when the R211 will do the same as the 160’s… serve as CBTC operable trains. If the 211’s go to Jamaica for the busiest lines, I don’t see personnel specifically keeping the R211’s off the  

Oh they wouldn't, and we've seen it first-hand with the "Cuomo-wrapped R160s" that were supposed to be on the , yet see more service on the  than anything else.

[darkstar8983]

1 hour ago, R32 3838 said:

 

They were slated to get the R211s for a long time. They aren't going to put brand new trains on a Part time . If it has open gangways, They will go to Jamaica for that alone. I know TA is stupid but not that stupid. Giving Coney Island R211s wouldn't make any sense anyway and the only reason they would probably get them is because of politics. 

 

When a new car order comes in, Cars get swapped all the time so Jamaica could lose 40 to 50% of their R160s back to coney.

Some good points:

1. The  doesn't have to be automatically disqualified from getting the R211s since its a part-time line. The  is a part-time line and it had the R160s

2. It is in the MTA's best interest to have both R211s and R160s in Jamaica Yard, while Pitkin/207 St has 10-car R179s and R211s, ENY has all 8-car R179s, 8-car R160As, and R143s (plus the supplement R211s in 8-car trains), while Concourse and Coney Island have R160s (the latter also having the R68s). This way each yard is responsible for maintenance for more than one-type of car (in the B division).

Although, I do not think this will be the assignment in the long term, nor should we expect any type of arrangement long-term when the cars are first delivered. As someone mentioned earlier, when subway cars are delivered, a lot of moving around occurs between all yards, since they have to focus on retiring the WORST performing cars first in a fleet designated for retirement, regardless of which yard they're in. Remember the R160 delivery? So many swaps (see below):

R160 cars delivered:

1. R32s immediately retired from the  and  (R160s to the  directly and 8-car R160As delivered to the and displaced R42s from both lines to Jamaica). The  and for a while had R40Ms, R42s, R46s, and ONE R32 train, while the  and had all R46s.

2. R40 slants shifted from  service to  and  service, with R40M cars shifted to Jamaica; (Some R42s, R40Ms, and slant R40s appear on the , but quickly taken off due to C/R board issues on R40 series cars (R40S, R40M, and R42 not having the door mechanism in the T/O positions in addition to C/R exclusive positions, like seen on the R32s and R38s, leading to a 5-3 configuration instead of a 4-4 like in the R32/R38), while R160s filled up slots on the , pushing down the R68s to the , then trickling down to the  (since the  ended up getting R160s and the  being 50/50 with R68s / R160s [[original plan was for to be R160 and  to be R68]].

3. When the R160s started appearing in Jamaica on the , all R40Ms and R42s shifted to  and  service, with R46s headed to Pitkin to immediately return the R44s. Then we ended up in a point where the R160s were alternating between being put into  and  service (very brief, where then it was decided to first fill up the  with R160s first, then focus on the , leaving the  with 10% R160s, 50% R46s, and 40% R40M/R42, the  with a mix of R46s and R40M/R42, and the lone  with its subset of R46s). It was a shitshow in Jamaica, figuring out which trains should be run on which routes each day, until the last R42/R40M train left. Jamaica, leaving the Express trains with R160s and locals with R46s.

 

Take home-message from point #2 is that Pitkin/207 St, and Jamaica Yards ended up assigned the soon-to-be retired R40s and R42s, then got their "permanent assignments"

 

Before R160s:

Pitkin/207 St: R44, R38, R32

Jamaica: R32, R46

Coney Island: R32, R40S, R40M, R68, R68A

ENY: R143, R42

 

DURING R160 delivery

Pitkin/207 St: R44 (eventually phased out by R46), R40M, R40S, R42 

Jamaica: R46, R40M, R42 (midway thru delivery, R160s appear here, displacing R46s to Pitkin and retiring R40M/R42)

Coney Island: R68, R68A, R160

ENY: R143, R42 (moved to Pitkin and Jamaica), R160A

 

Final Delivery

Pitkin/207 St: R46, R32

Jamaica: R46, R160

Coney Island: R68, R68A, R160

ENY: R143, R160A

 

This shows that the MTA has been known to have a haphazard way of dealing with things such as operations. I can only imagine how bad it was in Pitkin and Jamaica yards while all these cars were being moved everywhere and the yards didn't know which car class was really theirs to maintain.

Edited June 15, 2022 by darkstar8983

[Storm]

18 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

 

Astoria CBTC is back on the table so It wouldn't make sense to move the to Concourse now anyway since CIY would need CBTC equipped cars for all 3 lines. in 3 years the would need priority for tech trains while whatever is left would be for the until they receive more cars since Astoria CBTC is far out.

 

The can stay at Jamaica, They can handle it. It's not like it was Pre- 2010 when they had all lines in one yard. The is out of ENY yard so that's one less line they have at that yard.

The thing with the R211s, is, exercising all the option orders, well, there just wouldn’t be enough room. Look at Jamaica for instance. They can barely fit all their 160s. Think about it this way, the  line can only run a maximum of 300-350 cars as concourse is a smaller yard than people are making it out to be. People are assigning 600-700 cars there when they can’t even fit 400. Most of the yards need an upgrade. Coney Island Yard is fine, but yet it has too little cars for three lines, it’s quite ironic actually, 396 R46s for the  is quite little. We also need more rolling stock there, which hopefully the R68s and R160s will solve that problem.

[Storm]

4 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

Some good points:

1. The  doesn't have to be automatically disqualified from getting the R211s since its a part-time line. The  is a part-time line and it had the R160s

2. It is in the MTA's best interest to have both R211s and R160s in Jamaica Yard, while Pitkin/207 St has 10-car R179s and R211s, ENY has all 8-car R179s, 8-car R160As, and R143s (plus the supplement R211s in 8-car trains), while Concourse and Coney Island have R160s (the latter also having the R68s). This way each yard is responsible for maintenance for more than one-type of car (in the B division).

Although, I do not think this will be the assignment in the long term, nor should we expect any type of arrangement long-term when the cars are first delivered. As someone mentioned earlier, when subway cars are delivered, a lot of moving around occurs between all yards, since they have to focus on retiring the WORST performing cars first in a fleet designated for retirement, regardless of which yard they're in. Remember the R160 delivery? So many swaps (see below):

R160 cars delivered:

1. R32s immediately retired from the  and  (R160s to the  directly and 8-car R160As delivered to the and displaced R42s from both lines to Jamaica). The  and for a while had R40Ms, R42s, R46s, and ONE R32 train, while the  and had all R46s.

2. R40 slants shifted from  service to  and  service, with R40M cars shifted to Jamaica; (Some R42s, R40Ms, and slant R40s appear on the , but quickly taken off due to C/R board issues on R40 series cars (R40S, R40M, and R42 not having the door mechanism in the T/O positions in addition to C/R exclusive positions, like seen on the R32s and R38s, leading to a 5-3 configuration instead of a 4-4 like in the R32/R38), while R160s filled up slots on the , pushing down the R68s to the , then trickling down to the  (since the  ended up getting R160s and the  being 50/50 with R68s / R160s [[original plan was for to be R160 and  to be R68]].

3. When the R160s started appearing in Jamaica on the , all R40Ms and R42s shifted to  and  service, with R46s headed to Pitkin to immediately return the R44s. Then we ended up in a point where the R160s were alternating between being put into  and  service (very brief, where then it was decided to first fill up the  with R160s first, then focus on the , leaving the  with 10% R160s, 50% R46s, and 40% R40M/R42, the  with a mix of R46s and R40M/R42, and the lone  with its subset of R46s). It was a shitshow in Jamaica, figuring out which trains should be run on which routes each day, until the last R42/R40M train left. Jamaica, leaving the Express trains with R160s and locals with R46s.

 

Take home-message from point #2 is that Pitkin/207 St, and Jamaica Yards ended up assigned the soon-to-be retired R40s and R42s, then got their "permanent assignments"

 

Before R160s:

Pitkin/207 St: R44, R38, R32

Jamaica: R32, R46

Coney Island: R32, R40S, R40M, R68, R68A

ENY: R143, R42

 

DURING R160 delivery

Pitkin/207 St: R44 (eventually phased out by R46), R40M, R40S, R42 

Jamaica: R46, R40M, R42 (midway thru delivery, R160s appear here, displacing R46s to Pitkin and retiring R40M/R42)

Coney Island: R68, R68A, R160

ENY: R143, R42 (moved to Pitkin and Jamaica), R160A

 

Final Delivery

Pitkin/207 St: R46, R32

Jamaica: R46, R160

Coney Island: R68, R68A, R160

ENY: R143, R160A

 

This shows that the MTA has been known to have a haphazard way of dealing with things such as operations. I can only imagine how bad it was in Pitkin and Jamaica yards while all these cars were being moved everywhere and the yards didn't know which car class was really theirs to maintain.

This is a perfect example of how PLANS CAN CHANGE. The 160s were always meant for the  but then the Q got the 68s while the  got the 160s, until subsequent options arrived.

The R211 type cars were originally meant for the  (aka direct replacement). Now they’re meant for the , with the three bway lines having last priority for any NTTs. 
 

Who knows? Plans could change once again. Car assignments could change in a blink of an eye. You all know the TA. 

[Lil 57]

4 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

1. The  doesn't have to be automatically disqualified from getting the R211s since its a part-time line. The  is a part-time line and it had the R160s

Just as a fyi the  shares a fleet with the  with many trains switching routes at Astoria. During the times when the  doesn’t run, its fleet is being used by the . The  doesn’t share its fleet with any other line so its trains usually sit in the yard all weekend (Unless some of its trains are used on the  on the weekends in order to give the r46s a rest).

Edited June 16, 2022 by Lil 57

[trainfan22]

For those of you who think the MTA is bad, just look at all the issues MBTA has 

 

 

https://wnyt.com/news/federal-transit-agency-orders-improvements-to-boston-system/6500869/?utm_medium=onsite&utm_source=zetaglobal&utm_campaign=thumbnails

 

 

 

[Calvin]

32 minutes ago, Lil 57 said:

Just as a fyi the  shares a fleet with the  with many trains switching routes at Astoria. During the times when the  doesn’t run, its fleet is being used by the . The  doesn’t share its fleet with any other line so its trains usually sit in the yard all weekend (Unless some of its trains are used on the  on the weekends in order to give the r46s a rest).

The only time the  gives its R68/As out of Concourse lay-up to the was that suspension that happened around January and April-May 2020. It did take out the pressure of the 2500-2767 R68s that were used a lot, even though they are just for the Delta. 

[Daniel The Cool]

4 hours ago, Calvin said:

The only time the  gives its R68/As out of Concourse lay-up to the was that suspension that happened around January and April-May 2020. It did take out the pressure of the 2500-2767 R68s that were used a lot, even though they are just for the Delta. 

It didn't happen during the 2020 suspension. Some of the  Train layups was mainly used on the Lines.

[R32 3838]

10 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

Some good points:

1. The  doesn't have to be automatically disqualified from getting the R211s since its a part-time line. The  is a part-time line and it had the R160s

2. It is in the MTA's best interest to have both R211s and R160s in Jamaica Yard, while Pitkin/207 St has 10-car R179s and R211s, ENY has all 8-car R179s, 8-car R160As, and R143s (plus the supplement R211s in 8-car trains), while Concourse and Coney Island have R160s (the latter also having the R68s). This way each yard is responsible for maintenance for more than one-type of car (in the B division).

Although, I do not think this will be the assignment in the long term, nor should we expect any type of arrangement long-term when the cars are first delivered. As someone mentioned earlier, when subway cars are delivered, a lot of moving around occurs between all yards, since they have to focus on retiring the WORST performing cars first in a fleet designated for retirement, regardless of which yard they're in. Remember the R160 delivery? So many swaps (see below):

R160 cars delivered:

1. R32s immediately retired from the  and  (R160s to the  directly and 8-car R160As delivered to the and displaced R42s from both lines to Jamaica). The  and for a while had R40Ms, R42s, R46s, and ONE R32 train, while the  and had all R46s.

2. R40 slants shifted from  service to  and  service, with R40M cars shifted to Jamaica; (Some R42s, R40Ms, and slant R40s appear on the , but quickly taken off due to C/R board issues on R40 series cars (R40S, R40M, and R42 not having the door mechanism in the T/O positions in addition to C/R exclusive positions, like seen on the R32s and R38s, leading to a 5-3 configuration instead of a 4-4 like in the R32/R38), while R160s filled up slots on the , pushing down the R68s to the , then trickling down to the  (since the  ended up getting R160s and the  being 50/50 with R68s / R160s [[original plan was for to be R160 and  to be R68]].

3. When the R160s started appearing in Jamaica on the , all R40Ms and R42s shifted to  and  service, with R46s headed to Pitkin to immediately return the R44s. Then we ended up in a point where the R160s were alternating between being put into  and  service (very brief, where then it was decided to first fill up the  with R160s first, then focus on the , leaving the  with 10% R160s, 50% R46s, and 40% R40M/R42, the  with a mix of R46s and R40M/R42, and the lone  with its subset of R46s). It was a shitshow in Jamaica, figuring out which trains should be run on which routes each day, until the last R42/R40M train left. Jamaica, leaving the Express trains with R160s and locals with R46s.

 

Take home-message from point #2 is that Pitkin/207 St, and Jamaica Yards ended up assigned the soon-to-be retired R40s and R42s, then got their "permanent assignments"

 

Before R160s:

Pitkin/207 St: R44, R38, R32

Jamaica: R32, R46

Coney Island: R32, R40S, R40M, R68, R68A

ENY: R143, R42

 

DURING R160 delivery

Pitkin/207 St: R44 (eventually phased out by R46), R40M, R40S, R42 

Jamaica: R46, R40M, R42 (midway thru delivery, R160s appear here, displacing R46s to Pitkin and retiring R40M/R42)

Coney Island: R68, R68A, R160

ENY: R143, R42 (moved to Pitkin and Jamaica), R160A

 

Final Delivery

Pitkin/207 St: R46, R32

Jamaica: R46, R160

Coney Island: R68, R68A, R160

ENY: R143, R160A

 

This shows that the MTA has been known to have a haphazard way of dealing with things such as operations. I can only imagine how bad it was in Pitkin and Jamaica yards while all these cars were being moved everywhere and the yards didn't know which car class was really theirs to maintain.

 

 

Back then CBTC wasn't a priority and everything was a clusterf**k back then because they decided to retire the Phase II R32s after the CI rebuilt R42s and GE R32s instead of the R40 slants and R38s which were next in line after the CI R42s and GE R32s.

 

Now CBTC dictates where tech trains will go. CI yard or i should say the aren't a priority like the are. These 4 lines have to be fully tech within 4-5 years because of 8th ave CBTC. Astoria CBTC won't start until at least 5 to 7 years later since its probably the last after Crosstown so there is no rush to make those lines all tech trains yet. 

The shares with the so it would make sense for it to share fleet. The doesn't share its fleet with another line so it doesn't really need brand new trains vs the busier lines. the oldest R160s turn 17 within 3 weeks, Age is a factor in all of this.

 

People just want CIY to get new trains just for the sake of getting new trains when they don't really need anything new. Concourse hasn't gotten anything new in 33 years (R68As were at concourse when brand new) and the base order R211As  gotta go to the so they can make those two lines fully tech to prepare for CBTC.

 

This is why I say CIY would end up getting the R160s back instead of getting R211s, It makes more sense. R211s are for high ridership routes like the and lines.

 

Giving Jamaica the 20 R211Ts would make sense because it would allow them to do more testing and getting everyone familiar with the fleet and etc.  Giving Jamaica the base order R211As instead of the wouldn't make sense at all.

 

People need to stop thinking "Oh it would be a waste if Jamaica have to transfer those R160s back to CIY" Bullshit when cars are transferred or swapped all the time. 

 

5 hours ago, Storm said:

This is a perfect example of how PLANS CAN CHANGE. The 160s were always meant for the  but then the Q got the 68s while the  got the 160s, until subsequent options arrived.

The R211 type cars were originally meant for the  (aka direct replacement). Now they’re meant for the , with the three bway lines having last priority for any NTTs. 
 

Who knows? Plans could change once again. Car assignments could change in a blink of an eye. You all know the TA. 

 

No they weren't, They are required for lines that have CBTC or in the process of getting CBTC. That was always the Plan not to directly replace cars on said lines. The just happens to have R46s and in the process of getting CBTC so it goes hand and hand.  Broadway isn't getting CBTC any time soon and Astoria CBTC is last in line since Crosstown has more priority. 

need techs because of CBTC starting at 59th CC and etc.

 

Plans can't really change as much as a lot of you think. The only thing that could change is where any of the 5 car tech trains could end up between the IND lines because of CBTC.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 16, 2022 by R32 3838

[Maxwell179]

I don’t understand how Livonia on the  is fully accessible when the people on the Brownsville side still have to walk up the stairs, the footbridge, and another set of stairs just to get to the platforms.

Edited June 16, 2022 by Maxwell179

[darkstar8983]

7 hours ago, Daniel The Cool said:

It didn't happen during the 2020 suspension. Some of the  Train layups was mainly used on the Lines.

The Coney Island layups were on the  and the concourse layups were on the

[Daniel The Cool]

2 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

The Coney Island layups were on the  and the concourse layups were on the

I'm well aware. They didn't run on the  during the 2020 Suspension. They did run on the  several times in 2020 but was way after the was restored.

[Reptile]

It's strange to imagine that the subway's peak in ridership was over 2 billion yearly rides all the way back in 1946. And that was with the 9th, 6th, and 2nd avenue els demolished already. I suppose all the old infrastructure and signaling wasn't old at the time, and so with high frequencies and good seat layouts in the train cars handling the crowding wouldn't be much worse than today. It also explains the amount of services/service variations that were discontinued like the via tunnel, the and the express variant.

Edit: And the radical changes of the Chrystie Street connection hadn't happened yet.

Edited June 16, 2022 by Reptile

[Calvin]

The new schedule on the  starts on June 27th, 2022: 
- There will be 3 trains that'll end at Gun Hill Road on the  line instead of 1. The new one leaves at 8:42 AM from the Bowling Green station. 

- PM rush will have one train leave Dyre Av at 4:55 PM to Utica Av to go out of service at that last stop. There will be 3 late PM rush trains, 7:17 PM, 7:29 PM and 7:41 PM (12 minute headways) that'll end at Utica Av to go out of service. The last 5s to Nereid Av from Brooklyn: 5:42 PM from Utica Av and 5:45 PM from Flatbush Av. 

[Calvin]

4 hours ago, Calvin said:

The new schedule on the  starts on June 27th, 2022: 
- There will be 3 trains that'll end at Gun Hill Road on the  line instead of 2. The new one leaves at 8:42 AM from the Bowling Green station. 

- PM rush will have one train leave Dyre Av at 4:55 PM to Utica Av to go out of service at that last stop. There will be 3 late PM rush trains, 7:17 PM, 7:29 PM and 7:41 PM (12 minute headways) that'll end at Utica Av to go out of service. The last 5s to Nereid Av from Brooklyn: 5:42 PM from Utica Av and 5:45 PM from Flatbush Av. 

Also, during the AM rush, the  that leaves Utica Av are all bound to East 180 St. The 8:34 AM departure is not scheduled to Dyre Av from its current timetable. 

 

The  has one change to its timetable. The last AM rush train to Burnside Av: instead of 10:48 AM, it'll be 10:55 AM arriving at that stop at 11:51 AM. Goes out of service at noon time for rest at the Yard till 5 PM. 

[trainfan22]

While waiting for the train right now these teenagers jumped another teenager on the Manhattan bound platform, they was stomping on his head which is dangerous. The poor kid was dazed and incoherent after they was finished.

 

 

Crazy that this type of stuff happens in a station with a police station in it. 

[NoHacksJustKhaks]

17 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

While waiting for the train right now these teenagers jumped another teenager on the Manhattan bound platform, they was stomping on his head which is dangerous. The poor kid was dazed and incoherent after they was finished.

 

 

Crazy that this type of stuff happens in a station with a police station in it. 

teens in generation Z are just ruthless nowadays. Can't believe that happened on the platform

[Storm]

Also @R32 3838 @darkstar8983 Since Broadway will receive tremendous improvements from CBTC (probably the only line that will see improvements), I propose we build 6th Aveneue CBTC and Broadway CBTC around the same time, as they both reroute onto each other quite frequently. 

[R32 3838]

1 hour ago, NoHacksJustKhaks said:

teens in generation Z are just ruthless nowadays. Can't believe that happened on the platform

prior generations have done the same, Jumping people isn't new.

 

2 hours ago, trainfan22 said:

While waiting for the train right now these teenagers jumped another teenager on the Manhattan bound platform, they was stomping on his head which is dangerous. The poor kid was dazed and incoherent after they was finished.

 

 

Crazy that this type of stuff happens in a station with a police station in it. 

 

Nothing new, Just animals doing their thing. Anyone who jumps someone is a bitch.

 

1 hour ago, Storm said:

Also @R32 3838 @darkstar8983 Since Broadway will receive tremendous improvements from CBTC (probably the only line that will see improvements), I propose we build 6th Aveneue CBTC and Broadway CBTC around the same time, as they both reroute onto each other quite frequently. 

 

Broadway isn't on the roadmap yet which IMO Astoria CBTC should have included Broadway instead of having it from Ditmars to 57th/7th. They need to also de-interline that mess at 34th st before they even think about cbtc on Broadway.

[darkstar8983]

7 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

prior generations have done the same, Jumping people isn't new.

 

 

Nothing new, Just animals doing their thing. Anyone who jumps someone is a bitch.

 

 

Broadway isn't on the roadmap yet which IMO Astoria CBTC should have included Broadway instead of having it from Ditmars to 57th/7th. They need to also de-interline that mess at 34th st before they even think about cbtc on Broadway.

1. I am completely on board with Broadway CBTC concurrent with 6 Av due to the constant flip-flop that can occur (  and  via Broadway to 96 St, or  vía 6 Av.) 

2. Broadway CBTC would be more practical short term but de interlining would be better long-term, which means Astoria riders must get used to only Broadway Local service. The reason why we have the current  setup is because of ridership levels and car availability. Others have posted that de-interlining Broadway means sending the  to 96 St-2 Av (eventually points north); the  becoming the full-time Astoria-Bay Ridge service and the  running from 71 Av to Whitehall St (no overnight service). Maybe also no overnight  service north of Whitehall St if ridership on 2 Av/Broadway doesn’t need it, with the  maintaining 2 Av service and the  maintaining Astoria service. At the current state we cannot have this service setup because there aren’t enough cars or crews to run all this extra service, necessitating the need for the 34 St merge

[R32 3838]

15 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

1. I am completely on board with Broadway CBTC concurrent with 6 Av due to the constant flip-flop that can occur (  and  via Broadway to 96 St, or  vía 6 Av.) 

2. Broadway CBTC would be more practical short term but de interlining would be better long-term, which means Astoria riders must get used to only Broadway Local service. The reason why we have the current  setup is because of ridership levels and car availability. Others have posted that de-interlining Broadway means sending the  to 96 St-2 Av (eventually points north); the  becoming the full-time Astoria-Bay Ridge service and the  running from 71 Av to Whitehall St (no overnight service). Maybe also no overnight  service north of Whitehall St if ridership on 2 Av/Broadway doesn’t need it, with the  maintaining 2 Av service and the  maintaining Astoria service. At the current state we cannot have this service setup because there aren’t enough cars or crews to run all this extra service, necessitating the need for the 34 St merge

 

That's not happening. There is a reason why the swapped terminals back in 1987, Yard access is important.

[darkstar8983]

8 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

 

That's not happening. There is a reason why the swapped terminals back in 1987, Yard access is important.

You’re right about yard access, but that in itself is a double edged sword, especially for Broadway since the local tracks connect Astoria and QB to Bay Ridge, and ridership on Astoria has lead to the justification for having two routes (or one route with the service frequency of two routes). In theory, you could make the Sea Beach service local again via Lower Manhattan but it would cause merging issues like what we saw when the  had to stop at 53 and 45 Sts. This yard access issue is one of the justifications for wanting to make Broadway CBTC instead of just de interlining.

 

The  And eventually the second Avenue have a ways to go for one of their cars to make it to a yard. 

[Storm]

9 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

1. I am completely on board with Broadway CBTC concurrent with 6 Av due to the constant flip-flop that can occur (  and  via Broadway to 96 St, or  vía 6 Av.) 

2. Broadway CBTC would be more practical short term but de interlining would be better long-term, which means Astoria riders must get used to only Broadway Local service. The reason why we have the current  setup is because of ridership levels and car availability. Others have posted that de-interlining Broadway means sending the  to 96 St-2 Av (eventually points north); the  becoming the full-time Astoria-Bay Ridge service and the  running from 71 Av to Whitehall St (no overnight service). Maybe also no overnight  service north of Whitehall St if ridership on 2 Av/Broadway doesn’t need it, with the  maintaining 2 Av service and the  maintaining Astoria service. At the current state we cannot have this service setup because there aren’t enough cars or crews to run all this extra service, necessitating the need for the 34 St merge

With my plans, Broadway Express would receive CBTC first; and is probably priority for CBTC along that trunk. It’d make sense, as I’d send the  up to 96th street (as you suggested). I wish they made an express track (  SA Express,  SA local) but they didn’t. So my plans changed. Either we axe the  or send it to continental, and send the  to Astoria.

Phase A of deinterlining:

The easiest deinterlining would be done by flipping the  and ‘s northern terminuses. 

Phase B of deinterlining:

Now that we have the  going to Astoria, there’s no need for a second line going there. We can send the  to Second Avenue, as SAS can handle 40 TPH at max. The  would now run full time express.

Phase C of deinterlining:

This part is optional, and would lose riders their one seat ride. But, I’m going to share it anyway.

 via 4th Ave local, to Bay Ridge-95th Street

 via 4th Ave express, via Sea Beach, to Coney Island

 via Brighton Express, to Brighton Beach

 via Brighton Local, to Coney Island

 via West End, to Coney Island

Fleet assignments and TPH:

: R211; 15 TPH

: R211; 15 TPH

: R160; 16 TPH

: R160; 16 TPH

: R68; 13 TPH

: R211; 13 TPH

(THIS WOULD BE DONE AFTER BROADWAY EXPRESS GETS THE GREENLIGHT+ R68S ARE PHASED OUT)